Portrait of a Lady on Fire (2019) / June Pride #2
Join Nathan, Bee, and Sam as they dive deep into 'Portrait of a Lady on Fire' in the second episode of their June Pride exploration. The intense romance between Marianne and Héloïse, the film's breathtaking cinematography, and its exquisite sound mixing create a truly one of a kind cinematic experience.
02:04 - Walmart Woes
04:07 - This Week's Movie: Portrait of a Lady on Fire
11:30 - Nathan's Review
16:03 - Sam's Review
18:29 - Bee's Review
30:54 - The Id, Ego, and Superego
39:53 Interpreting Orpheus and Eurydice
42:31 The Final Symphony Scene
51:28 The Decision: SAVE OR PURGE!!!
52:51 Movie Pairings and Recommendations
01:00:00 Weekly Highlight and (New Segment)
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Transcript
In the dying embers of human existence, as the asteroid, a behemoth the size of
Speaker:Texas, hurdles relentlessly toward Earth, the world braces for an apocalyptic end.
Speaker:Deep beneath the bunker, a refuge plunges into the bowels of the Earth.
Speaker:Here, the chosen gather.
Speaker:Their purpose clear, to preserve the very soul of our civilization.
Speaker:The 35 and 70 millimeter prints that encapsulate the magic, the emotion,
Speaker:and the dreams of generations past.
Speaker:These masterpieces, each frame a testament to the human spirit, are
Speaker:carefully cataloged and cradled in the cavernous confines of the bunker.
Speaker:Perhaps there was room for more.
Speaker:For friends and family yearning for salvation, but sacrifices must be made.
Speaker:The movie nerds stand united, the keepers of a flame, promising a future where the
Speaker:art of storytelling endures, transcending the boundaries of time and space.
Speaker:God help us all.
Nathan:Welcome to Back to the Framerate, part of the Western Media Podcast Network.
Nathan:Join us as we watch and discuss films on VOD and streaming platforms, deliberating
Nathan:on whether each one is worthy of salvation or destined for destruction in the face
Nathan:of the impending asteroid apocalypse.
Nathan:You can find more episodes of our podcast on back to the framerate.
Nathan:com where you can subscribe and share our shows and find us on our
Nathan:socials at back to the framerate.
Nathan:I'm Nathan Shore and accompanying me are the extraordinary movie mavens,
Nathan:Brianna Budworth and Sam Cole.
Nathan:How are you guys tonight?
Nathan:Hello.
Nathan:I'm great.
Nathan:What was that saying?
Nathan:I am here from the hills of fire.
Nathan:No, I don't know.
Nathan:I thought you could do like Lothar
Nathan:from the hill people or something.
Nathan:Lothar.
Nathan:Remember Lothar?
Nathan:The Mike Myers character from
Nathan:Saturday Night Live?
Nathan:Oh my god.
Nathan:Yes.
Sam:That's also similar to the name of an orc in the game Warcraft 2.
Sam:Yes.
Nathan:I can't wait to talk about this movie tonight.
Nathan:I don't have a question.
Nathan:I dropped the ball completely.
Nathan:I
Sam:actually, I actually have a question for you guys.
Sam:It's a bit of a non sequitur, but have you ever gone to Walmart and you buy
Sam:stuff in the tech section and there's no one manning the desk in the tech?
Sam:Section.
Sam:Yet that's a location where they can, like, you can make the purchase there
Sam:so you don't have to wait in the line.
Sam:And so you're hopeful, but it's never manned.
Sam:Is this just me or is this a universal Walmart experience?
Bee:Universal.
Bee:And it's really disappointing because one of my favorite things to get at Walmart
Bee:is a bargain Blu ray or a bargain DVD, and they often have those big buckets
Bee:that I can sift through just up to my elbows and old like Adam Sandler movies.
Bee:I love that.
Nathan:Dependent on like the Walmart employee that works in that tech section
Nathan:to like unlock something for you.
Nathan:Cause you can just take it some, go somewhere else.
Nathan:No,
Sam:not to unlock it, but like you can cash out there.
Sam:Like they have a desk there.
Sam:And so it's so convenient to do that.
Sam:But like when I buy one thing and you go to the main line and there's like
Sam:1200 people, like buying everything for the next three weeks, you're
Sam:like, man, I wish that desk was mad.
Nathan:What's preventing people from doing the opposite?
Nathan:Like you want to buy your.
Nathan:Slippers and your Cheetos going to the tech section.
Nathan:Can you do that?
Sam:That's true.
Sam:That's a good point.
Sam:I don't know.
Sam:You could, I guess, but it'd be kind of like, I don't think
Sam:anyone has thought to do that.
Sam:Cause it's like there it's out of their way.
Sam:Like, and if they're getting like food, they're closer to the main aisles anyway.
Sam:And the usual Wal Mart map layout.
Sam:Imagine somebody just It's like paying for
Bee:your gum at the pharmacy, you know?
Sam:Exactly.
Sam:Yeah.
Nathan:I think I've done that.
Bee:Have you done that?
Bee:Well, I Sometimes those pharmacy lines get long.
Bee:When I do
Nathan:pick up a prescription, I do load up.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Oh yeah.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:That is the time.
Bee:These subjects
Sam:would be perfect for that Saturday Night Live skit, What Up With That?
Sam:My favorite.
Sam:Ha ha
Bee:ha ha.
Bee:Kenan's an institution.
Sam:Amazing.
Bee:Ah.
Nathan:Well, this has nothing to do with our, our, what we watched this week.
Nathan:Yeah, that was a non sequitur.
Nathan:Yeah, you're not
Bee:going to find a movie like this in the bargain bin at Walmart.
Nathan:Absolutely not.
Nathan:But what we watched this week was a portrait.
Nathan:Of a lady on fire.
Nathan:This was the first time I watched it.
Nathan:And I think we'll, I can't wait to talk about this with everyone, but I
Nathan:have a trailer that's not in English.
Nathan:We watched a foreign movie guys.
Nathan:I think this is the first one.
Nathan:Non English language.
Nathan:Could this be the first one on our podcast?
Nathan:I'm trying to recall.
Bee:Since I joined.
Bee:I think maybe, hang on, I have the episode.
Sam:It's possible and to me it was really enlightening because up
Sam:until last week, I did not know that there was anything beyond the ocean.
Sam:I thought it was just, I didn't know there were other countries, like, I just, I just
Sam:thought it was USA, Walmart, and ocean.
Sam:I was 100
Bee:percent sure you were going to say up until this week, I
Bee:didn't know how to speak French.
Sam:No, I still do not know how to speak French, unfortunately.
Bee:Me neither.
Bee:I'm not, I'm not
Sam:proud of this fact, but Spanish, a little bit Spanish.
Sam:I could get somewhere like in a, in a vehicle, probably.
Sam:I can
Nathan:get by a little bit on Spanish.
Nathan:I lived in Los Angeles for three years and I picked up a lot.
Nathan:And, and yeah, I picked up a little bit, you know, anyways, let me play
Nathan:the trailer for this and, you know, Take away from a what you can.
Nathan:I don't know.
Nathan:She's waiting for you.
Nathan:I've been dreaming of doing this for years.
Nathan:Die?
Nathan:Run.
Nathan:Glances and the music is swelling.
Nathan:And you know that it's a foreign language movie because nobody speaks in it.
Nathan:And I think I probably saw a trailer for this, you know, five years ago.
Nathan:I'm like, ah, I, this is not an English cause no one's
Nathan:speaking and he's saying anything
Bee:and it's not a dialogue.
Bee:Heavy movie to say.
Bee:Start with in, in any language, but they sure the dialogue that's there.
Bee:I find cutting
Nathan:and resourceful.
Nathan:So I'll just read a quick plot synopsis here, and then
Nathan:we'll get to some movie facts.
Nathan:So France, 1770, Marianne, a painter is commissioned to do
Nathan:a wedding portrait of somebody.
Nathan:Tell me if I say this wrong, Heloise.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:Heloise?
Nathan:Heloise?
Bee:I think Heloise.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:I don't know if her
Nathan:name is ever said in this movie.
Nathan:I, I, I don't remember.
Nathan:I'm sure it is.
Nathan:I couldn't, I was waiting for somebody to say her name in the movie.
Nathan:Anyways, Heloise, a young woman who has just left The convent.
Nathan:Heloise is a reluctant bride to be and Marianne must paint
Nathan:her without her knowing.
Nathan:She observes her by day to paint her secretly.
Bee:Hot.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:So Sam, I know you dreaded this moment.
Nathan:Whip out all of that, that French dialect that you've been practicing.
Nathan:I,
Sam:I think in order, in order not to offend the world, I will
Sam:read the movie facts as normal and as well respected as possible.
Nathan:I want you to do it as the, the, the most ignorant American
Nathan:Yeah, could you read this from
Bee:inside a Walmart, actually?
Bee:Could you?
Sam:Oh, gosh.
Sam:That's a hard character to portray because there's so many
Sam:versions of it in this country.
Sam:But I will begin by saying that Portrait of a Lady on Fire is a
Sam:2019 French historical romantic drama film, Céline Sciamma.
Sam:With two amazing, unbelievably realistic performances from
Sam:Noemi Merlot and Adele Hanel.
Sam:And their acting is incredible.
Sam:Let's see this movie also was released May 2019 to Cannes Film Festival.
Sam:It's budget was 4.
Sam:86 million and its box office was 10 million.
Sam:So it did solidly well.
Sam:And.
Sam:And I would really like to point out the cinematography by Claire Mathon, which I
Sam:just thought was amazing in this movie.
Sam:Like I, gorgeous, looked her up and obviously because I can't speak
Sam:French, there were some films of like French, French films and foreign films.
Sam:I hadn't heard of her cinematography was so good.
Sam:I was like half wondering if it was like Roger Deakins or like, I
Sam:expected to find some random big name.
Sam:That's the level of quality of like the visuals in this movie.
Sam:I thought,
Sam:yeah,
Sam:It was edited by Julian Lachery.
Sam:And this also won the film, won the queer palm at Cairns becoming the first
Sam:film directed by women to win the award.
Sam:Sciamma also won the award for best screenplay at Cannes and
Sam:the film was theatrically, excuse me, theatrically released in
Sam:France on 18th of September 2019.
Sam:And there are some, some more data.
Sam:I don't know if you guys want to have any thoughts or there's tidbits.
Sam:And it was
Nathan:released, I think, in the United States on December 6th of
Nathan:2019 and it charted at number 39.
Sam:Wow.
Nathan:It's
Sam:really caught the attention of Americans and it came
Nathan:in right after a great documentary called Fantastic Fungi.
Nathan:Have you ever seen that?
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:I've heard
Nathan:of it.
Nathan:I have not seen it.
Nathan:Amazing documentary.
Nathan:It
Bee:is fantastic.
Nathan:Wasn't wasn't much else that debuted that week in December.
Nathan:But number one at the box office was Frozen 2.
Nathan:It was a great
Bee:year for movies.
Bee:2019 was great.
Bee:And for foreign films.
Bee:Parasite, right?
Nathan:Yes.
Nathan:I don't, I don't have any other real facts about this because yeah, that's it.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Thank you, Sam.
Sam:Thank you.
Sam:So yeah, in a nutshell, it was genuinely well received.
Nathan:Yeah, I did look at all the awards.
Nathan:This thing, there's a laundry list of festivals that this thing was
Nathan:submitted to and was nominated and won.
Nathan:It's more than I could go through, but it was very impressive.
Nathan:Very, very well regarded film.
Bee:It's also worth noting, I think until Petite Maman, which came out
Bee:after Portrait, I think Adele Annel was in every one or most of Celine
Bee:Sciamma's films, not that she has.
Bee:An extensive filmography, there's a number of shorts in
Bee:there, but that's how they met.
Nathan:Okay, well, I drew the short straw, so I guess I'm going first.
Nathan:I've been
Bee:dying to know what you think of it.
Bee:I'm glad you're going first.
Nathan:So, all right, so the first thing, let me move my mic a little closer
Nathan:because I think it's far away from me.
Nathan:So, a little peek, you know, behind the curtain to our listeners.
Nathan:We have this group thread.
Nathan:You know, which I'm sure it doesn't surprise anybody, but I messaged everyone.
Nathan:In our, in our, between the three of our hosts.
Nathan:And I specifically was targeting you B, because I think you're the lone member of
Nathan:our team that has seen this film before.
Nathan:And I asked, is this basically two hours of edging?
Nathan:Because that's what this movie felt like to me.
Nathan:And it's not, it's not a negative thing.
Nathan:Just, you know, this is such an incredibly intense, charged, Romance
Nathan:that it's really depicted beautifully.
Nathan:Nothing about the actual romance we see is, is graphically explicit.
Nathan:I did not find, you know, the nudity titillating or gratuitous.
Nathan:The eroticism lives in the glances and the observations that Marianne
Nathan:and share with each other.
Nathan:This movie is about.
Nathan:The power of gazing and observing, and you can cut the sexual tension
Nathan:between these two with a knife.
Nathan:But I'm getting ahead of myself.
Bee:Well, no, I'm glad you brought this up because this movie really
Bee:spurred a big conversation about the female versus the male gaze in cinema.
Nathan:I think, I think this movie is a masterpiece and I'm underlying think
Nathan:because my takeaway Is that I really can't find a single flaw with this film.
Bee:I, I'm totally with you.
Bee:I'm sure that
Nathan:everyone here is gonna say the same thing.
Nathan:Every frame of this movie looks like a painting.
Nathan:You know, you CMU complimented the cinematography.
Nathan:I, I think it's even more than that.
Nathan:There, there is a, a famous Dutch painter Johanna's Vermeer.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:And.
Nathan:I think there are so many frames of this movie that look like a Vermeer painting.
Nathan:And he was, he was known for these lifelike, lifelike
Nathan:paintings of, of people.
Nathan:And I, at times where like these characters just kind of like
Nathan:standing there, looking at each other, gazing at each other.
Nathan:I'm, I feel like I'm looking at a Vermeer painting.
Nathan:But like a moving Vermeer painting at times.
Nathan:So I was just mesmerized by watching this movie.
Nathan:The two leads we've already talked about B are just outstanding.
Nathan:And actually this film is really a three hander.
Nathan:I have, I have a lot of thoughts on the Sophie character, but the
Nathan:two main women, Who's again, I was, I'm afraid to even say their names
Nathan:because I don't want to butcher it, but they're, they're two of the best
Nathan:performances I may have ever seen.
Nathan:I think they're incredible.
Nathan:Adele, you already talked about I think we should mention this, that how she
Nathan:has left the acting industry, which.
Nathan:I think it's a shame, but I fully understand and support
Nathan:the reasons for her doing this.
Nathan:But I think it's interesting that, you know, we can talk more about that.
Nathan:But I guess there's just one thing.
Nathan:I guess I'll, I'm not calling it a gripe, but it's the, it's actually a result
Nathan:of how incredible the two leads are.
Nathan:And this is going to sound kind of weird.
Nathan:But the movie did feel a little stagy, and it's not, and it's not in a bad way.
Nathan:I was constantly.
Nathan:I was constantly snapped back into my world of watching this as
Nathan:a gazer, sensing the acting, the acting is very forward facing.
Nathan:Can I offer something on that?
Nathan:Yeah, go ahead.
Bee:I think that's exactly what they're talking about with Orpheus and Eurydice.
Bee:You're forced to turn back and look.
Bee:I think.
Bee:This whole movie is about that.
Nathan:There's a lot in there, yeah.
Nathan:The facade of this whole thing, as, as, if I could see the actors putting on
Nathan:their characters, their costumes, and pretending to be these people, and I'm
Nathan:not saying that these are bad performances at all, they are absolutely amazing, I
Nathan:think they're some of the best I've ever seen, but there's something about the
Nathan:story, the characters felt like theater to me, like, where I sensed, The real
Nathan:actors underneath the performances.
Nathan:So this is a, maybe a minor quarrel, maybe it's intended.
Nathan:I don't know, but this is a five star movie, possibly absolute masterpiece.
Nathan:That's all I got.
Bee:All right, Sam.
Bee:All
Sam:right.
Sam:I would, I would definitely agree with that.
Sam:And, and I think for me, the main thing that I like about this film,
Sam:the main reason why I like it.
Sam:Any movie that I love is because, for me, I felt like these characters were real,
Sam:like the performances were so good, the situation felt real, the, the production
Sam:design felt real, the authenticity, I, I mean, I, I I, I knew I was going to
Sam:like this film, oddly enough, I kind of tend to zero in on like seemingly
Sam:random scenes, but when she was like, riding in on the boat on the like rowboat
Sam:at the beginning, they just felt like they got the, it just felt like I was
Sam:in that time, you know what I mean?
Sam:And so, I was like, I know what you mean about the like that feeling
Sam:of like occasional staginess, Nathan, I didn't get that.
Sam:But I do.
Sam:I see how that there are like a lot of long like very like, you
Sam:know, withheld pauses in this film.
Sam:And so I can see that kind of feeling creeping in.
Sam:But for me, The character seems so real that I was more of what focused
Sam:on, I just felt the situation unfold and like, what's going to happen?
Sam:Like, how is this relationship going to progress?
Sam:Will it fall apart?
Sam:Like, obviously it's got to end.
Sam:The mother's coming back.
Sam:She's going to leave.
Sam:She's getting married.
Sam:This is great.
Sam:So I just got drawn into it.
Sam:And I think that's a power a testament to like the incredible, like actors,
Sam:the filmmaker, just the whole.
Sam:Yeah.
Sam:the whole production.
Sam:And again, I, it's funny, it's a film that I would not necessarily have been drawn to
Sam:or like aware of, if not for the podcast.
Sam:And like, I'm glad I watched it because that I, the genre itself, like it
Sam:normally wouldn't be something I'm immediately drawn to, but like, I
Sam:just found this movie very engrossing.
Sam:I would, I solidly liked it a lot.
Sam:I would give it four.
Sam:Stars.
Bee:Nice.
Bee:Nice.
Bee:You gentlemen are arbiters of good taste.
Bee:Thank you for coming to the podcast tonight.
Bee:Yes.
Sam:I changed my mind.
Sam:One star.
Sam:I want a movie about Walmart.
Sam:This is boring.
Sam:These women talking on a beach.
Sam:Boring.
Sam:No, I'm just kidding.
Sam:They're not even talking in English.
Sam:I don't know what
Sam:Everything else I
Nathan:said was true.
Nathan:I didn't have my subtitles on, so I don't know what they're saying.
Bee:I watched
Nathan:the dubbed version.
Bee:Weirdly, Robert Pattinson was in this dubbed version.
Bee:Yeah, no, I'm.
Bee:I, for me, this is a 10 out of 10 masterpiece.
Bee:I love this movie.
Bee:I love all of Celine Siama's movie.
Bee:I saw this was the first one I saw from her and then I went back and did her whole
Bee:filmography and it's absolutely worth it.
Bee:I think everything about this movie is so layered and delicate.
Bee:And every relationship in this movie just serves to give the, the a story,
Bee:the romance, I think more dimension.
Bee:I think the B plot with with the, the houseworker and the abortion is
Bee:really well done and really beautiful.
Bee:But I also think that that level of friendship and them getting to explore
Bee:each other in the context of how they treat another person just adds more
Bee:dimension into their relationship, too.
Bee:I think that's great.
Bee:It's absolutely, I think, about observation and and really seeing
Bee:someone for who they are and seeing yourself for who you are.
Bee:from their perspective for the first time and allowing yourself to be, to
Bee:live in your truth and be the kind of person that you want them to see
Bee:and that you want them to look for.
Bee:The last 15 minutes of this movie are seared into my brain.
Bee:I think it's a perfect, Ending.
Bee:There's a few endings and I, and it's beautiful to the, to the blocking.
Bee:One thing about this movie, the camera doesn't move a lot.
Bee:There's a lot of shots that are still, and then there's movement within
Bee:that, that do feel very painterly.
Bee:What's up, Sam?
Sam:No, I was going to say, I totally agree.
Sam:I was just saying that's, I think what Nathan was saying about the staginess.
Sam:I think that's where you get that feeling from just that in my opinion.
Sam:But yeah.
Sam:It's also in
Nathan:the performance as well, because there is a couple
Nathan:of times I don't want to.
Nathan:Interrupt, but I'm watching the two actresses and I feel like they almost
Nathan:are this close to breaking character.
Nathan:Like they're like, they, they want to like crack up, like, like they're
Nathan:having so much fun in these roles.
Nathan:I felt like, and had such great chemistry that I felt like when
Nathan:they kill cut, they're like, like, they just want to, like,
Bee:chemistry is off the charts for me, my favorite scenes in
Bee:this movie happen in the kitchen.
Bee:And, and.
Bee:You know, you can dig into what that means from a feminine perspective
Bee:too, but all of that still camerawork just facing the table.
Bee:And I love when the mother goes away and the maid is there stitching
Bee:and the two of them are like, Oh, we get to play house now.
Bee:And one's in the fire cooking, the other one's pouring wine.
Bee:It's just really lovely to see.
Bee:And then of course the bonfire is beautiful.
Bee:Transcendental.
Bee:I don't know how else to describe that.
Bee:I'm obsessed with it.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:We'll talk about it, but 5 out of 5.
Bee:Love it.
Sam:I also forgot to mention that I meant to say in my review, but
Sam:the The sound mixing is incredible.
Sam:Like, I can hear the crackling of every single, like, Ember of wood in the
Sam:fireplaces and in all the scenes with fireplaces or like when they're talking
Sam:so close and there's so much tension, like someone will like swallow or you're,
Sam:you'll like hear like a throat noise.
Sam:Like the audio is amped in this film.
Sam:It's crisp.
Sam:I
Nathan:have a confession.
Nathan:Like I, I can watch someone paint all day and it's not just about painting.
Nathan:It's the, the sound of those.
Nathan:Tools that they use the, that the, the metal on a canvas that's scraping sound
Nathan:is like an ASMR experience for me.
Nathan:Cool.
Nathan:And I seriously, watch this, I was getting like goosebumps as
Nathan:they're like the, the technique of creating in the hand movement.
Nathan:I don't know if these were the actual actresses hands doing this.
Nathan:If they, if they are, it'll be, it was unbelievable.
Nathan:Like seeing the meticulous, you know you know, movement, hand
Nathan:movements of painting these things.
Nathan:I could have watched two hours of somebody just making, drawing a portrait, painting
Nathan:a portrait and the sound of that doing it.
Nathan:You
Bee:got armpit sex.
Bee:You got, you got armpit
Nathan:sex.
Nathan:That's right.
Nathan:I was like, that was very jarring.
Nathan:There's a couple interesting smash cuts in this movie that, Yeah.
Nathan:But yeah,
Nathan:wow.
Nathan:Couple of things here.
Nathan:I don't know who wants to, who wants to continue this.
Bee:I was just going to sort of start from the top a little bit.
Bee:So, you know, she, she comes in and we get introduced to the mom really quickly
Bee:who we haven't talked about much, but.
Nathan:Do you know who that is?
Nathan:Valerie Galeno.
Bee:Yes, she's amazing.
Nathan:She, Sam, Valerie Galeno, you know who, I didn't
Nathan:realize who this was at first.
Nathan:She's been in so much stuff like big top peewee rain man.
Nathan:I didn't realize who I was watching at first.
Nathan:Hot shots.
Nathan:Hot shots.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:She's an awesome.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:She's, she's a rock
Bee:star.
Bee:I think I'm supposed to do
Nathan:also,
Bee:I think I'm supposed to not like her character very
Bee:much, but I love her character.
Bee:I totally get where she's coming from in the sense of freedom that she wants for
Bee:her daughter that can only be afforded through these societal constructions.
Bee:Which that's,
Sam:that's the thing.
Sam:She's like a real, like you were saying, be like a real three, like
Sam:these all feel like real people.
Sam:Like if this was a poorly directed or acted movie, she'd be like the
Sam:one note villain mother who was like, you will marry the blah, blah, blah,
Sam:blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Sam:And she's like a three dimensional person who like.
Sam:Has desires and then you hear her plan about wanting to go
Sam:to Milan and it actually sounds kind of good like, you know I
Bee:know and she like lights up when she's speaking Italian
Bee:And
Bee:she has this great little hair pieces adorable
Bee:So she has a plan to trick sorry guy
Nathan:No, go ahead.
Nathan:You're talking with the mom.
Nathan:Go ahead.
Bee:And then together they hatch a plan to, to trick Heloise's character
Bee:into being painted by saying she has a, a promenade companion, right?
Bee:We're just going to go on walks together.
Bee:So gay, you guys.
Bee:But, we're just going to go on walks together and, and she's just observing her
Bee:and, and, And Heloise's character allowing herself to be observed is already such a
Bee:break because we learned that the former painter, she wasn't allowed to do that.
Bee:And I think that just act of letting someone in, the walls are coming down
Bee:a little bit and the romance starts to, and to, Spice up absolutely.
Sam:And like, speaking of the walls, her entrance as a character where
Sam:she's like shrouded in the like,
Sam:it's like the most
Sam:dramatic, like, this is the character.
Sam:Yes.
Sam:Yes.
Nathan:There's a great, this is an unbelief.
Nathan:And I made a note of this.
Nathan:There's, there's a point, and this is, like I said, this is a movie about
Nathan:the power of, of glances and gazes.
Nathan:And there's, you know, they're standing out on this cliff.
Nathan:This is one of the most striking shots I think I've ever seen in cinema where
Nathan:Marian and Heloise are, they're looking out at the ocean over the cliff.
Nathan:And it's like the side profile of them.
Nathan:And, but, but Heloise is kind of like eclipsed by Marian as they're looking out.
Nathan:And, but as Marian turns to look at her.
Nathan:Heloise's face is revealed as looking back at her in this darting stare, and then
Nathan:this exchange goes on for a few moments.
Nathan:It's either foreshadowing or inferring that these two characters are going
Nathan:to share this intimacy very soon.
Nathan:Because if this, in this shot, they're literally sharing like one body almost.
Nathan:I just love this moment.
Nathan:Yeah, I know exactly what shot you're
Bee:talking about.
Bee:It's gorgeous.
Bee:And,
Nathan:and, and, It seems like such a simple shooting
Nathan:technique, but it's so effective.
Nathan:And I can't think of another film I've seen that done like this.
Nathan:And I'm just, I, I watched, I actually rewound it and watched it again.
Nathan:Cause it was like, wow.
Nathan:And the location for this is like, it's almost looks like something from
Nathan:A big budget science fiction movie.
Nathan:Like I thought this would be like a Marvel movie or something from the
Nathan:Star Wars universe or something.
Nathan:This location.
Nathan:It's the colors just
Bee:really sing to me.
Bee:They're so beautiful.
Bee:I can't, I can't get enough of it.
Sam:I wonder where exactly they shot it.
Sam:I missed that.
Sam:I'm sure that's in the Wikipedia.
Sam:I'll check that.
Sam:But like.
Sam:It must have been somewhere like, I love the coastal, like I, I
Sam:hope it's, I wouldn't be surprised if it was birthday soon on a
Nathan:new walks of world.
Nathan:Sam
Nathan:. Sam: Exactly.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:. Yeah, definitely epic landscape for sure.
Nathan:Yeah.
Bee:Yeah, it was, it was.
Bee:It's filmed in in Brittany.
Nathan:Oh, cool.
Bee:Mm hmm.
Nathan:Get on that, Sam.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:Field trip.
Bee:Already
Nathan:on it.
Nathan:It's flight booked.
Nathan:Let's
Bee:go.
Bee:But yeah, their, their romance starts to develop.
Bee:They're going on these walks together and of course she's painting her in secret.
Bee:She finishes a painting that we get to see and when you see the
Bee:painting reveal, the first one.
Bee:What did you two think?
Bee:Did you, were you like, Oh yeah, she nailed that painting.
Bee:Or were you like, I was like, it's not quite
Bee:her.
Nathan:Like I'm actually, it's like, it didn't look quite like her, but I
Nathan:was thinking myself, is this, is this like the greatest rendition of Heloise?
Nathan:I'm like, no, I didn't think
Sam:it was bad, but it was formal.
Sam:Like it, it was like a her, but with a blank stare kind of,
Bee:yeah, the rules and conventions to
Sam:it.
Sam:Yeah.
Bee:And I love that Heloise was so honest about it and so angry.
Bee:Like, I let you in.
Bee:I let you spend so much time on the beach watching me.
Bee:And, and this is what you come back with?
Bee:But
Nathan:she says like, is this how you see me?
Nathan:Also, I was like,
Bee:Ooh, yeah,
Nathan:that
Sam:was intense.
Nathan:Yeah.
Bee:And then it comes back to the marriage, right?
Bee:This is how I'm not the only one that has to have this in mind.
Nathan:It's more to that.
Nathan:Like it says, is this how you see me?
Nathan:Marian says, it's now only me.
Nathan:There are rules, conventions, ideas.
Nathan:I wrote this down here.
Nathan:You mean there is no life, no presence.
Nathan:Your presence is made up of fleeting moments that may lack truth.
Nathan:So it was like, yeah.
Bee:And at that point I am just.
Bee:ceased on the floor.
Bee:And then this movie
Sam:does need to win.
Sam:They need to create a new like Oscar category for like best tension ever.
Sam:Like that's like the melodrama
Nathan:is so rich in this film.
Nathan:But
Bee:the two like already are kind of in cahoots and they Without talking are
Bee:able to, to, to prolong this process and get the house to themselves which
Bee:is when this becomes the third, the three hander you talked about, Nathan.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Well, the reason why I also feel as a three hander, cause you know, we, we
Nathan:haven't even gotten into this whole.
Nathan:other piece of this, which is the, this, the story that it's kind of
Nathan:being compared to the, the Morpheus and Eurydice, but also this, I mean, this
Nathan:is also a, a a classic, a comparison example of three carriers that are
Nathan:representing the, the human psyche, the id, the ego, and the super ego.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:You've got Heloise.
Nathan:Clearly the ID, you know, the ID represents the, the, the, the
Nathan:primal desires, instinctive drives.
Nathan:Heloise embodies the this aspect through, you know, emotions
Nathan:and desires and the passion.
Nathan:And he got Marianne, who's the ego, you know, the ego is the mediates
Nathan:between the aid and the super ego.
Nathan:And in reality Marianne is the artist.
Nathan:you know, she's observing and processing the emotions and desires
Nathan:and and feels for Heloise, right?
Nathan:And she's creating that balance.
Nathan:And, you know, she's tasked with painting Heloise and she's
Nathan:grappling with the professional obligations of balancing emotions.
Nathan:And it's mirroring the ego's role in, in between desires and the moral constraints.
Nathan:And we haven't talked about Sophie yet, but Sophie is the super ego.
Nathan:Sophie,
Nathan:you know, the super ego represents, you know,
Nathan:societal norms and ideals.
Nathan:She's the maid.
Nathan:And, you know, The maid is you know, supporting the, the, the societal
Nathan:structures and, and moral standards.
Nathan:You know, this is the classic, you know, we've pegged them
Nathan:perfectly, you know, is in this.
Nathan:So it's, it's
Bee:interesting because I was looking at their trinity, that's
Bee:a great read and I love that.
Bee:But I was thinking of this Trinity.
Bee:In mythology and in classical literature too, like we have the fates and we have
Bee:the three witches and we have like this, this trio of three, that's, that's just
Bee:this classical, like this story is going to get told through them and you know
Bee:how it's going to end already, right?
Bee:This movie is deep,
Nathan:I think.
Bee:You're there,
Nathan:I know!
Nathan:But yeah, so I, I didn't know much about.
Nathan:I'm going to sound naive.
Nathan:I didn't know anything really about Orpheus and Eurydice.
Nathan:Eurydice?
Nathan:Eurydice?
Nathan:I
Nathan:actually had to do a little bit more research on this afterwards.
Nathan:So I, I, I was a novice.
Nathan:But after I paused the movie and I actually had to like go on the
Nathan:internet and like read about this.
Nathan:All of a sudden, like, I'm like, Oh, okay, everything here is about this story.
Nathan:Oh, pretty much everything is about this character, like turning
Nathan:around and her lover disappears.
Nathan:It's, this is happening this entire film, but what surprised me and I
Nathan:don't want to jump too far ahead if we want to talk more about things, but
Nathan:like, I thought this movie was going to end in a much bigger tragedy also.
Nathan:You know, I mean, in a way it does me too.
Sam:I was, I was worried about that.
Sam:Like I was like, Oh, this is building to, and I was like,
Sam:glad that she still is alive,
Nathan:especially with what we've learned about the sister who.
Nathan:Falls off the cliff.
Nathan:I thought this was going to be some sort of self fulfilling prophecy that
Nathan:this was, this is going to end up at the bottom of this cliff somehow,
Nathan:you know, especially with, she was going to feel trapped by, by what,
Nathan:what her future was going to be like.
Nathan:They were never going to be the, the future was never going to be what
Nathan:they thought it Wanted it to be and she was gonna be faced with something
Nathan:and or commit suicide or something.
Nathan:I had no idea where this was gonna go, but, mm-Hmm.
Nathan:I thought we were going to a much more darker ending.
Nathan:It seems like, you know, for the most part, it could have been, it could have
Nathan:been a lot worse for, I feel like the
Bee:ending's pretty dark.
Bee:It, but it's not, it death.
Bee:That's true.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:I think the ending to me is well, we'll talk, we'll talk about the ending.
Bee:We'll get, we'll, we'll get there when we
Nathan:get there.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:But in the meantime, we meet Sophie and, you know, Sophie's very matter
Bee:of fact, like you said, you know, she, she knows the ins and outs of this.
Bee:Island.
Bee:And she, she helps lead the women a little bit out, out of their
Bee:shell while mom's away and, and cats away, the mice will play.
Bee:I love her character.
Bee:I think she's really funny.
Nathan:I liked her a lot.
Nathan:Yeah, she is.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:What did you think of, I kept trying to figure out if there
Nathan:was some meaning behind.
Nathan:The dress colors.
Nathan:I know this might be getting really super deep, but you know,
Nathan:typically Heloise is in a green dress and Marianne's in a red dress.
Nathan:And I don't know if you guys, this might be getting way too
Nathan:geeky, but I, I noticed that.
Nathan:And I was like, you know, green nature, Maybe purity, maybe, I don't know.
Nathan:Red is usually more passion and, and fire, but that felt
Nathan:like it would be the opposite.
Nathan:So I was, I was a little intrigued if I was reading it in a weird way.
Nathan:I was trying to figure that out.
Nathan:Is
Bee:Sophie, here's, is Sophie in a yellowish or a beige ish?
Bee:I think she is because then they're in primary colors until
Bee:they come together to paint.
Nathan:And she's in green.
Nathan:We have red, green, Cause green is the dress
Bee:she's painted in, but Heloise is normally in blue.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:By the way, it's really interesting.
Nathan:The green dress, that green dress does not want to be painted.
Nathan:Everybody's in that, like their head is either, you just notice like either
Nathan:the painting, like it's cut off or when at one time somebody is looking
Nathan:in the mirror and their head is literally cut off in the shot as well.
Nathan:Yeah, it was, it was interesting how.
Nathan:That it's, we're always kind of avoiding like seeing somebody for a while
Nathan:in that green dress in full frame.
Nathan:And I thought that was kind of interesting.
Nathan:That's true.
Nathan:Yeah.
Bee:I think that's a good way to do a face reveal with Eloise too, when
Bee:it's her sitting for the first time.
Bee:I love the costuming in this.
Bee:I think it's gorgeous.
Bee:It's so textural.
Bee:Everything in this movie just feels like, like you could just pick it
Bee:up and, and touch it and feel it.
Bee:It's great.
Bee:How do you guys like the abortion B plot?
Bee:I don't know how else to say that.
Nathan:I thought it was, you know, think about, you know, there's today.
Nathan:If somebody wants to go and think about getting an abortion,
Nathan:I feel like there's counseling.
Nathan:Like, do you really not want this baby?
Nathan:Are you sure?
Nathan:Have you considered like putting up for adoption?
Nathan:And I feel like this is like the 1770 equivalent of that because
Nathan:she's put down right next to a baby.
Nathan:And I feel like, are you sure about this?
Nathan:Because There's a baby right here.
Nathan:I thought that was so messed up.
Nathan:So
Bee:messed up.
Bee:It did.
Bee:It did feel very like very matter of fact, you know, this is life.
Bee:We're poor.
Bee:You can't afford this kind of stuff.
Bee:Like, where am I supposed to put this kid?
Bee:You know, but
Nathan:it's like, this is as I was thinking of right now, it's like,
Nathan:it's, it's felt a little bit like that clinic you walk into like,
Nathan:well, you know, baby right here.
Nathan:You sure?
Bee:Baby.
Bee:I.
Bee:Appreciated that she just immediately had the support of, of everyone around her.
Bee:And they really, they tried every, I thought making her run
Bee:back and forth was really funny,
Bee:making
Bee:her run back and forth on the beach.
Bee:Like there was some great levity in this movie and it happens around
Bee:this, which was just so smart.
Bee:The scene where they're crouched in the grass and they all pop up like meerkats
Bee:at the same time is just beautiful to look at, but then you realize what they're
Nathan:doing.
Bee:Exactly.
Bee:You scare
Nathan:a baby out of her.
Nathan:I scare a
Bee:baby.
Bee:And then, and then of course it's, it's, is, you know, it is deeper than that.
Bee:And it's about women helping other women and forming bonds outside of society
Bee:because they weren't allowed to be their true selves and they weren't allowed to
Bee:lead the kind of lives they want to live.
Bee:So it, it relied on this radical collective care that still
Bee:exists today that we often need.
Bee:And, you know, I think the bonfire scene Is the perfect example of that.
Bee:And just all those voices crescendoing out of the dark is so incredible.
Sam:Yeah.
Sam:Stunning.
Sam:So
Bee:stunning.
Bee:And then of course you get that, that moment where the two of them, I think,
Bee:realize that they love each other.
Bee:That, that look across the fire is just, that's it, man.
Bee:I'm done.
Bee:And she smiles again
Nathan:in that.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Oh, by the way, So, like I said, you know, I, I was joking before about this
Nathan:movie being about two hours of edging.
Nathan:The, the, the best release this movie, I think, had was the moment
Nathan:that Heloise actually smiles.
Nathan:Cause it was like, it's like, cause like all, I, I almost
Nathan:didn't care about the romance.
Nathan:Just smile.
Nathan:Well, you know,
Bee:well, you know, she took her time being funny.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:And the moment she does and cracks a smile, I was like, Oh, thank God.
Nathan:It's just like, like, yeah.
Nathan:So if, and it felt like I could relax and I think that happened
Nathan:almost over an hour into this movie.
Nathan:And it was like, I felt like I could finally just like settle
Nathan:into my seat and like, have a good time with this movie after that.
Nathan:But yeah, it, it really, really took off after that for me.
Nathan:I really had a great time.
Nathan:There's, let's see, there's a few other things here.
Nathan:The visions that start to come up in this after, you know, cause the,
Nathan:the whole story is introduced and.
Nathan:Um, Marianne starts having these visions of Heloise in this
Nathan:white, in this white dress and.
Nathan:Of course mirroring the, the, the, the story that they were read,
Nathan:the they read gave me chills.
Nathan:Like really?
Nathan:It was haunting.
Nathan:Yeah, I really, I really, really, it was effective.
Nathan:Can we talk
Bee:a little bit about the story, because there's a few emotional and plot
Bee:developments that happen when it's a trio.
Bee:Mm-Hmm.
Bee:. And one is that, heloise starts asking Marianne to paint, to draw
Bee:them in books, to draw out the the scene, to sort of process what the
Bee:three of them went through together.
Bee:That is sort of a catalyst where she starts to find joy and, and
Bee:take part of the process and take ownership of her image.
Bee:And the other one is this story where they're sort of developing the
Bee:narrative for, themselves through the lens of Orpheus and Eurydice and
Bee:specifically that, that ending sequence that Heloise is reading aloud to the
Bee:table because they didn't have TV.
Bee:I don't know if you knew that.
Bee:So they had to read the Greeks.
Bee:And so.
Bee:And, and the end is where, of course Eurydice is in the Underworld and,
Bee:and he's trying to get her back, but he's made a deal and they say if
Bee:you turn back and look for Eurydice, then she'll be trapped here forever.
Bee:And he can't resist and he looks back for her and she's trapped and he moves on.
Bee:And the three of them offer their own interpretation in the
Bee:moment of what that could mean.
Bee:Thank you.
Bee:And they're defining the ending of this movie for us before it
Bee:happens, like the Fates, right?
Bee:Like the Three Witches.
Bee:And they're saying, you know, did they, did he make the poet's choice?
Bee:Is he choosing the memory?
Bee:The lover's choice versus
Nathan:the poet's choice.
Bee:Choosing to remember her.
Bee:And Heloise says maybe she's made a choice.
Bee:Maybe she said, look at me.
Bee:Which is the choice that she's been making this whole movie.
Bee:So I, What's your read on it?
Nathan:And I remember Sophie was, like, appalled.
Nathan:Like, why would, why would they do that?
Nathan:Like, that was so stupid.
Nathan:All you had to do was not turn around, and everything would have been fine.
Nathan:Sophie's
Nathan:like these
Nathan:dumb, damn men.
Nathan:So pragmatic.
Nathan:Like, why would you, why would you do this?
Nathan:I remember finding
Sam:that story very emotional, like, when I first heard it in fifth grade.
Sam:I was like, I looked back, and like, I just, that was like, To my mind then
Sam:that was such an intensely epic story.
Sam:I was like, oh my god the tragedy.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah That was my I remember that was my main takeaway.
Nathan:I remember just Sophie being so like like angry at at How that how that turned
Nathan:out and like why were you such an idiot?
Nathan:All I had to do is just not turn around and keep going
Nathan:And I'm trying to figure out if my, how it relates to the ending though.
Bee:So the very end where where they're hearing music and it's,
Bee:it's, we assume Heloise's first time at the symphony and they're playing
Bee:the Vivaldi that Marianne played for seasons together, the four seasons.
Bee:And she's looking and she's looking like she's behind.
Bee:They almost switched places.
Bee:Like now she's Eurydice and she.
Bee:It's just wondering if, if she'll turn back and look at her
Nathan:from across the, from across
Bee:the balcony
Nathan:because, you know, like we're,
Bee:we're left thinking about that final look, you know, that
Bee:final moment and they're sort of chasing each other through history,
Bee:you
Bee:know, and she's dropping all these clues, the 28, the
Bee:book, like, You know, but
Sam:then, but when they're at the play, like she doesn't turn and see her there.
Sam:Like they don't, she doesn't turn.
Sam:Yeah.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:It's unfulfilled.
Bee:Right.
Bee:I kind of
Sam:like that.
Nathan:That's interesting.
Nathan:I have so many thoughts in the end of this, but I didn't really think about
Nathan:it that way, but that's, that's great.
Nathan:I guess I'll, I'll share a couple thoughts on, on the end.
Nathan:I mean, first of all, I was, I guess we could, no, I'll mention about
Nathan:the end because I love the ending of this movie, but I was also sort
Nathan:of conflicted for a little bit.
Nathan:I saw this about four days ago.
Nathan:So it's, I guess it's years later after the events of this, like nine
Nathan:or 10 days that they had together at, you know, and, and Marianne goes
Nathan:to this art gallery where there's a, there's some showing or so.
Nathan:And
Nathan:we obviously we see her and she, there's a portrait
Nathan:of her with a child as well.
Nathan:And it looks like the child's maybe what, what, five or six years old or so.
Nathan:So sometimes gone by and she has the finger placed on inside
Nathan:of page 28, which is amazing.
Nathan:I love that moment because what we haven't said is that when, when,
Nathan:when, when, when, when, when, when, Earlier in the movie, she asked Mary
Nathan:to paint a little self portrait of herself inside the book on page 28.
Nathan:And she drew a self portrait.
Nathan:So obviously her love has never faded.
Nathan:And I'm trying, I actually trying to imagine the conversation
Nathan:between Heloise and the painter, you know, which is kind of funny.
Nathan:Just, yeah, right little 28 right here, or maybe she comes around
Nathan:like, Hey, just give me that.
Nathan:Paintbrush.
Nathan:All right, there you go.
Nathan:I've seen some,
Bee:some sort of cute interpretations where the eight kind of looks
Bee:like an infinity symbol, right?
Bee:So it'd be like two of us forever.
Bee:It's kind of cute.
Bee:I don't know if that was intentional, but.
Bee:So
Nathan:now at the concert, Marianne sees Heloise from across the concert hall and.
Nathan:She never sees Marianne and the music begins, it gets super loud.
Nathan:You know, we got all these four seasons being played.
Nathan:It's by the way, it's the same music that Marianne plays in the
Nathan:harpsichord earlier in the film.
Nathan:And you can see that, you know, that rush of emotions and memories.
Nathan:All hitting hoes at the same time.
Nathan:It's actually, it's just an incredible feat of acting also.
Nathan:Yes.
Nathan:What you see there.
Nathan:But here's the thing.
Nathan:For a while, I was like, I love this, but it also kind of felt like a double ending.
Nathan:And I was wondering, did I need this moment?
Nathan:Because I, for a while, I felt like.
Nathan:I need, I got everything I needed out of the story of these two.
Nathan:When I saw that page 28, it told me everything about what I
Nathan:needed from this relationship.
Nathan:And that was like the aha moment.
Nathan:Hell we just love never faded.
Nathan:And.
Nathan:Marion got to see, cause it's also set up.
Nathan:I, she says it like twice.
Nathan:I got to see Heloise one more time.
Nathan:I got to see her one more time.
Nathan:And I thought it would have been actually kind of cool if that seeing
Nathan:her meant like in that portrait.
Nathan:And that would have been like, Oh, I got to see her there.
Nathan:That's her seeing her.
Nathan:And that's what I thought, thought where the movie was trying to go.
Nathan:But so if the movie ended right there, I would have thought this
Nathan:was the greatest ending ever.
Nathan:Honestly, no, I think, and I think there's an argument to be made
Nathan:that final scene didn't with at the concert hall wasn't needed, but it was
Nathan:superfluous, but I've been, I've been going back and forth, but I am now
Nathan:convinced that the concert hall scene.
Nathan:Actually add something really great to it because what the gallery scene is doing
Nathan:is allowing Marianne to see Heloise.
Nathan:What the concert hall scene is doing is allowing Heloise to
Nathan:see Marianne through the music.
Bee:Yes,
Nathan:because that was their connection.
Nathan:It's the memory of her.
Nathan:It's the memory.
Nathan:So we're now seeing.
Nathan:everything rushing through Heloise in that moment.
Nathan:She, we're now seeing her see.
Nathan:Marianne.
Nathan:And we wouldn't have gotten that otherwise.
Nathan:Cause I was still like doing it.
Nathan:It feels like a double, it felt like we get it, the ending.
Nathan:Now we're getting the ending again, but it is showing us
Nathan:another perspective of that love.
Bee:And it's, it's, I think it comes back to that, the myth the Orpheus myth
Bee:and just seeing Heloise from Marianne's perspective, raw and unvarnished and not.
Bee:not with a purpose, just seeing her as she remembers.
Bee:And then, you know, then it puts another layer on Marianne's painting
Bee:in the previous scene, because you mentioned we see the painting of
Bee:Heloise, but Marianne has a piece in that art show, which is why she's there.
Bee:And it's the moment of the turn from the Orpheus and Eurydice myth.
Bee:And, a collector comes up and says it's almost as if they're saying
Bee:goodbye to each other in this moment.
Bee:And, and I think you, you have that.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:It's it's a masterful piece of acting.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:I, I got nothing else.
Bee:Sam, what'd you think of the ending?
Sam:I liked it.
Sam:I mean, I, I, I, but again, this whole movie, like I felt emotionally
Sam:drawn in and so whether the ending was necessary or not, I was just happy
Sam:to see another moment and see her,
Sam:see her,
Sam:and I, and I thought I was convinced that she was going to
Sam:turn and see her and she didn't.
Sam:And that surprised me.
Sam:And that just kind of.
Sam:Felt like, you know, added a bit of like melancholy to it.
Sam:That ambiguity and like a little bit of tragedy.
Sam:But I, I liked the theater ending.
Sam:Like I was just, I was glad it was there.
Sam:Cause I was emotionally involved.
Nathan:I've never been so much at the edge of my seat, watching somebody
Nathan:just listen to music, like at that final scene, like, what's, is she
Nathan:just gonna like look and looked over across the concert hall or what?
Nathan:I was like, It was, it was incredible.
Nathan:Yeah.
Bee:And so I wanted to pull up this quote from Celine Siama about the ending.
Bee:She said, yes.
Bee:And also because I wanted to question what a happy ending is.
Bee:We have the romantic comedy philosophy of frozen image of two people being together.
Bee:And we also have the tragic ending and I wanted neither.
Bee:Why do we believe that eternal possession of somebody means a happy ending?
Bee:Love educates us about art.
Bee:Art consoles us from lost love.
Bee:Our great loves are a condition of our future love.
Bee:This film is the memory of a love story.
Bee:It's sad, but it's full of hope.
Bee:She's smart.
Bee:I love
Sam:that.
Sam:That was, that was, that truly was amazing.
Sam:I just love the adage.
Sam:She's smart.
Bee:She's smart.
Bee:That
Sam:was a very like, funny adage.
Sam:Family guy.
Sam:Like this speech is like, that was wicked.
Sam:Great.
Sam:Lois.
Sam:Oh,
Sam:but no, but amazing.
Sam:Yeah.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Are we ready for a little break?
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Thanks for checking out our podcast and a review of portrait of a lady on fire.
Nathan:If you agree.
Nathan:Or disagree with our views.
Nathan:Don't keep it to yourselves.
Nathan:We would love to know your thoughts.
Nathan:Sharing your feedback is essential to building a community around
Nathan:all of our love of movies.
Nathan:You can do so by sending an email to back to the framerate at gmail.
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Nathan:If you could please take just a moment and leave us a solid rating
Nathan:review on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to our show.
Nathan:We thank you all in advance.
Nathan:It is time for us to decide if we are going to save or purge.
Bee:Yeah, this is a real nail biter.
Nathan:Gee,
Nathan:I wonder what's gonna happen here.
Nathan:Yeah, this movie is great.
Nathan:I gave it five stars.
Nathan:This, I don't think there's ever been a movie that I so instantly
Nathan:went on Criterion and looked up, like, how, where can I get the, the
Nathan:the, the Criterion Blu ray of this?
Nathan:Cause I may do that right away.
Nathan:Cause I, I was, I do want to.
Nathan:See what special features are on this.
Nathan:This, this movie was incredible and it's been on my list of movies to watch
Nathan:for years and years, and I'm so glad that we decided to watch it this week.
Nathan:So yeah, this is a save, a no brainer.
Bee:Nice
Bee:save
Bee:control S
Bee:just kidding.
Bee:Purge it.
Bee:No, I save it.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:It's an obvious.
Nathan:I remember the sound effect this week.
Bee:Nice.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Don't have to add it in post.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Let's do our movie pairings, which.
Bee:Okay.
Bee:So
Nathan:we're keeping them as surprise.
Nathan:I don't have my little set, my little sound effect.
Nathan:Sam, I don't have my sound effect, but you know what I do have?
Sam:What is that?
Sam:What is the sound effect?
Nathan:Well, I usually, I don't have my little, the bumper.
Nathan:The bumper for it, but you know what I do have?
Nathan:Because I couldn't find.
Nathan:I lost the file for it.
Nathan:I have this.
Bee:We got twins!
Nathan:Twins!
Bee:Nathan, so for listeners, we're keeping our, our double feature
Bee:pairings a surprise from each other.
Bee:And I, Nathan, you're going first.
Bee:I'm going last.
Bee:I have a genuine concern that you and I have the same pairing.
Bee:So , I'm dying to know what your story is.
Sam:Damn.
Bee:Does your, while you're
Sam:worried about that, since, since double feature pairing
Sam:doesn't have a song, might I suggest double feature pairing.
Sam:Double feature
Sam:pairing.
Sam:Now I'm really
Nathan:concerned too, GI, gimme the slightest hint of yours.
Nathan:The slightest hint,
Nathan:. Bee: Oh, there's nothing subtle about the movie I'm going to do.
Nathan:Go ahead.
Nathan:Just do it.
Nathan:If it's, if it's that one, I'll pick a different one.
Nathan:Okay.
Sam:So let me guess newsroom with Jeff Daniels, right?
Sam:It's Rambo three.
Bee:America is the greatest.
Nathan:My movie pairing this week.
Nathan:I think is very appropriate because watching these two films together will
Nathan:incite another form of temptation where Portrait of a Lady on Fire is what I
Nathan:equate to two hour, a two hour lap dance.
Nathan:You can look, but don't touch, but boy, does it get your motor running.
Nathan:The two thousand.
Nathan:Lashley Hallstrom film, Chocolat, equally, equally titillates
Nathan:a different set of senses.
Bee:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Bee:Okay.
Bee:We don't have the same movie.
Bee:That of
Nathan:the exquisite looking confections that are crafted by
Nathan:the film's lead, Juliette Binoche.
Nathan:Who's always incredible.
Bee:I love her.
Bee:You've also
Nathan:got Dame Judi Dench, Alfred Molina, Johnny Depp, and Carrie Anne Moss.
Nathan:You know, what, what an incredible run for Carrie Anne Moss back around this time.
Nathan:She did The Matrix.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:Memento, and this film within like a year.
Bee:Did you mention Molina too?
Bee:Sorry if I missed it.
Bee:Alfred Molina.
Nathan:Oh yeah.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:Who's incredible.
Nathan:I'm about to mention something.
Nathan:So, but now she's Can we start like a
Bee:Molina film?
Bee:Fan club.
Bee:I know
Nathan:he's awesome.
Nathan:Character moves into a small French village and all she wants to do is bring
Nathan:the most decadent chocolate confections imaginable to the locals, but there's
Nathan:some resistance from the Alfred Molina character who is steeped in tradition
Nathan:and his moral high ground, but he's also, you know, a very complicated character.
Nathan:And I don't want to spoil the ending, but there's just a great scene with
Nathan:Alfred Molina at the end of this movie that I can't talk about if you haven't
Nathan:seen it, but he is so good in this.
Bee:Just watch Shock a lot.
Bee:I know.
Bee:I
Nathan:think this is a great double feature because, well, first of
Nathan:all, you've got the French setting, but the protagonists is, you know,
Nathan:are also both strong female leads.
Nathan:Both films explore social norms, personal freedoms, empowerment, self discovery.
Nathan:But the films have very different tones.
Nathan:Chocolates are much more whimsical.
Nathan:Which would you
Bee:watch first?
Bee:Oh,
Nathan:I'd watch Portrait first, then Chocolate to end it.
Bee:A little palette cleanser.
Bee:Oh,
Nathan:yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:I still think it's a great pairing because by the end of the night,
Nathan:you're you're going to feel some.
Nathan:Tantalizing emotions in some form or another.
Nathan:So,
Bee:yeah.
Nathan:Because, you know, sex and chocolate, you know?
Bee:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Bee:They go together like sex and chocolate.
Bee:Yeah.
Sam:All right.
Sam:So this is a very, very thinly drawn connection, but both movies are about,
Sam:yes, that was the thing dedicated to the valent, no, I'm not gonna,
Sam:nevermind but the movie action.
Sam:Wow.
Sam:No, I'm like, yeah.
Nathan:I'm so sorry.
Nathan:That's okay.
Nathan:You derailed my point.
Nathan:Pre programmed AI speech, B.
Nathan:Thanks a lot.
Nathan:No, I'm just kidding.
Nathan:By the way,
Nathan:Shotgun on Amazon is on prime video.
Nathan:I should have mentioned.
Nathan:Go ahead.
Sam:So the film I would pick is it's, it's like forbidden love completely
Sam:different, but the one thing they have in common are both incredibly,
Sam:Well acted films that feel real to me.
Sam:This movie is a film by Adrian Lynn called unfaithful.
Sam:Very intense with Richard Gere and, and Diane Lane and totally different
Sam:story of like forbidden passion.
Sam:Even though the themes of these two films are entirely different,
Sam:it is sexy and intense and, and like just rife with tension.
Sam:So watch these movies.
Sam:Both together in a single night to literally just like be rung
Sam:out and then he'll fall asleep.
Bee:When, when we did American Gigolo, we wanted to pick like underrated Richard
Bee:Gere movies so listeners can, can go back.
Bee:But I think this, I don't think this is underrated.
Sam:Yeah,
Nathan:the movie is incredible.
Nathan:It's a great movie.
Nathan:It came up during that.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Unfaithful is available on Hulu and Showtime.
Nathan:Should watch it.
Nathan:Yup.
Sam:One sound effect we definitely need for the show, Nathan, and maybe
Sam:I can get it is, is John Malkovich and in the line of fire when he's going,
Sam:whoo, whoo,
Sam:he's watching the president.
Sam:Cause I imitate that all the time and I remind me the real soundbite.
Sam:Yeah.
Sam:Remind me.
Sam:All right.
Bee:All right.
Bee:Me next.
Bee:So I went with another queer love story.
Bee:Another Adam could be, well, this one is, is I guess more of an overt adaptation.
Bee:My own private Idaho, 1991, Gus Van Sant.
Bee:Probably.
Bee:I still have not
Sam:seen that movie.
Sam:I gotta see that
Bee:film.
Bee:This is another one that I'm like, this might be a masterpiece.
Bee:I think it's wonderfully done.
Bee:Henry the fourth.
Bee:So it's a take on that, which Nathan, I know we want to do a
Bee:Shakespeare one of these days.
Bee:We could always throw that in there.
Bee:But this is, this is a great movie.
Bee:I don't want to give too much away, but you should watch it for the cast alone.
Bee:Keanu Reeves and of course River Phoenix earned this.
Bee:They play the two leads.
Bee:You should check it out.
Bee:It's on VOD and it's, it's not much for a few bucks.
Bee:It's, it's a great, albeit Is a tough double pairing, but you can do it.
Bee:It's worth it.
Bee:You can do it.
Bee:You can do it.
Bee:You can do it.
Bee:You can do it.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:These are some great recommendations.
Nathan:Awesome.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:There we
Nathan:have it.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:So
Bee:sad boys and some sad girls.
Bee:Back to the framerate.
Bee:All right.
Nathan:Well, we're cooking tonight.
Nathan:I feel like we, we've been talking for a long time, but yeah, we've only
Nathan:been on the hour in, how about this?
Nathan:You know, I, I want to float something by you guys because I, I watch something.
Nathan:I want to introduce maybe something segment that we could do
Nathan:periodically if we have time for it, but I would like to propose.
Nathan:Something maybe called a weekly highlight where we mentioned one thing that we
Nathan:either watched or did this past week.
Nathan:And I'd like, we don't, this could be completely optional,
Nathan:but I'd like to mention one thing that I watched this week.
Nathan:I watched hit man, the new Richard.
Nathan:I just
Bee:watched that like right before this podcast.
Nathan:Okay.
Nathan:Well, you can chime in too.
Nathan:So I, I, I did, I watched this and I gotta say, I thought this movie was.
Nathan:a lot of fun.
Nathan:I think it's a good appetizer for the even bigger Glenn Powell
Nathan:vehicle, Twisters coming out in July.
Nathan:Hitman, like I said, is the latest from Richard Linklater.
Nathan:And I knew that going into it, I watched this whole movie and then when it was
Nathan:done and the credits came up and I saw Linklater's name as a director,
Nathan:I was like, holy shit, that's right.
Nathan:He directed this because it's weird.
Nathan:watching Hitman because it completely left my consciousness that he was
Nathan:behind this movie because I thought this had a completely different aesthetic.
Nathan:But Richard Linklater is doing a lot of different types of movies these days.
Nathan:And it shouldn't surprise me because he really is doing a lot to, to,
Nathan:to flex himself as a director and do different kinds of movies.
Nathan:But this was this was like something I feel like he's never done before.
Nathan:This is a very popcorn movie.
Nathan:And but I, I liked it a lot.
Nathan:I was really surprised.
Sam:I've got to see it.
Sam:Cause I didn't even know that he directed that.
Sam:And I'm a big, like Richard Linklater fan.
Sam:Like I love a lot of his movies.
Sam:Yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:And he co wrote this with Glenn Powell.
Nathan:And so it has a very different feel to this.
Nathan:Glenn Powell, he's he stars as this kind of like this nebbish college professor.
Nathan:And he kind of, he moonlights with the New Orleans Police Department helping
Nathan:them with their sting operations.
Nathan:Which
Bee:is a crazy premise that you have to buy into immediately.
Bee:It is.
Bee:It's the most
Nathan:ridiculous scenario ever.
Bee:So it asks you, Sam, to buy in, and this is not a spoiler.
Bee:It asks you in the first five minutes of the movie to accept
Bee:that a college professor would be working part time like this.
Bee:Just on retainer for the local police department setting up like
Bee:wire trap traps and video footage.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:It's it's a stretch.
Sam:But
Nathan:the funny thing is he's this he, but this is part of the whole thing.
Nathan:He finds himself as the face of the operation where he is the one that's going
Nathan:undercover as the fake hit man, you know, to solicit, you know, Would be entrapped.
Bee:These potential
Nathan:first half of this movie, I thought we had some legitimately
Nathan:funny moments with Glenn Paul.
Nathan:And I think he does a good job in it, especially where he has to keep on
Nathan:creating these many different personas to meet up with these customers.
Nathan:But this film, I kind of got into a conventional romantic
Nathan:comedy, somewhat action final act,
Bee:but
Nathan:it's, it's still.
Nathan:Pretty good.
Nathan:I thought.
Nathan:So I, I do recommend it cause even when it's, it could have gone to, to some very
Nathan:conventional down the conventional path, it did surprise me because this isn't,
Nathan:this isn't just like typical schlock, this, this does do some smart things.
Bee:I thought it was really good.
Bee:I think.
Bee:You know, Glenn Powell is an and some of these other up and coming movie stars
Bee:are on a trajectory with their careers.
Bee:That's really a breath of fresh air separate from franchises.
Bee:And so watching them do these sort of genre vehicles is fun.
Bee:And I, I like what Glenn Powell's doing here.
Bee:I thought this was very link later.
Bee:Actually, I'm surprised.
Bee:I thought this was, I did not have his fingerprints all over it.
Bee:But especially at the soundtracks of Banger, that was great.
Bee:But yeah, it's totally a popcorn movie, like you said.
Bee:There's, there's room in the ecosystem for that.
Nathan:I gotta check it out.
Nathan:Yeah, Sam, I think you would like it a lot.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:I do, yeah.
Nathan:Yeah.
Nathan:Sam,
Sam:Yeah, I did.
Sam:I did.
Sam:I was gonna say, I did see Bad Boys Ride or Die, which I'd like to point out.
Sam:Yeah, I did.
Sam:Yeah.
Sam:Yes.
Sam:Did well, solidly well this weekend.
Sam:56.
Sam:The box office is back!
Sam:The box office is back, exactly.
Sam:Leave it to Will and Marima!
Sam:No, but but so, I, I solidly enjoyed it.
Sam:I thought the chemistry between them was great.
Sam:Like it was a lot of fun.
Sam:It was it like, obviously all those films are formulaic.
Sam:It followed the formula quite to a T where I thought it did feel a little
Sam:tired in parts, but there was a lot of fun action and spectacle and humor.
Sam:And Martin Lawrence was hilarious and Will Smith was good.
Sam:And like I, I, I enjoyed it and I will say I just wanted to quote a reviewer,
Sam:a guy named Bilge Abiri that writes for the New York Vulture movie review.
Sam:I do agree with this.
Sam:I liked Bad Boys Ride or Die a lot.
Sam:I thought it was, you know, they had sort of a smaller budget, even
Sam:though it was still 90 million, but the two directors did some really
Sam:incredible, inventive acting.
Sam:Action scenes, but just to quote this review that I totally agree with nothing
Sam:here can and begin quote nothing here can hold a candle to bad boys twos highway
Sam:chase involving a car carrying trailer dumping all its cars onto the road or
Sam:bad boys to chase involving a morgue van dumping all its carcasses on the road
Sam:or bad boys twos chase drug shantytown where all the houses kept blowing up
Sam:as Mike and Marcus Plowed through them.
Sam:You might see where this is going.
Sam:Basically, nothing here can match anything in bad boys too, which was a
Sam:mess, certainly, but a glorious mess filled with some of the most ludicrously
Sam:over the top action scenes of all time.
Sam:And I agree because I love bad boys too is because it's just nuts.
Sam:It's totally insane.
Sam:So this was fun.
Sam:I enjoyed it.
Sam:It's good to see the characters.
Sam:It just, you could just feel a little bit of, of.
Sam:Franchise fatigue, a little formulaic, but some really good action and the
Sam:positive outweighed the negative.
Sam:So, I would give it like, I'd give it three, three and a half, yeah.
Nathan:And in one, in just one weekend, it's already made back its budget.
Sam:Yeah, I was just so glad that, like, I was glad that to see a movie
Sam:make money this friggin summer.
Sam:Like, break the curse.
Sam:Except Planet of the Apes did well, but yeah.
Sam:Get
Nathan:ready for Bad Boys 5 in two years.
Sam:Yeah.
Sam:I will happily go.
Sam:I think you know what it is.
Sam:I will lastly say, because I love action movies.
Sam:I feel that some of the earlier bad boys were like cutting edge action sequences.
Sam:This movie was good.
Sam:Some inventive action, but not like cutting edge to if they, if
Sam:they hear this podcast for bad boys, five guys, you have to.
Sam:Go all out and like blow up an oil tanker or something like make it huge.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:Yes.
Bee:Go fast and furious.
Bee:Just keep getting bigger.
Bee:Exactly.
Bee:Bigger, bigger.
Bee:That's awesome.
Bee:I want, I watched a good movie this week.
Bee:I watched last stop in Yuma County.
Bee:Has anyone heard of this?
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:I have not actually.
Nathan:I heard it's really good, but I know it's pretty good.
Nathan:Yeah,
Bee:it's pretty good.
Bee:It's an
Nathan:awful title, but yes.
Bee:Well, it just kept making me think of 310 to Yuma, but
Bee:newcomer Francis Gluppy, gloopy.
Bee:I'm not sure.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:It was pretty good.
Bee:It's, it, it totally earns all the reviews that say it's reminiscent of some early
Bee:Coen Brothers stuff but that's not bad.
Bee:You know, those are great movies.
Bee:I'm, I'm happy to watch that.
Bee:It's got great pacing.
Bee:It's got a good story.
Bee:I'm not totally sold on the ending of it, but it's a really fun, easy watch.
Bee:I caught it on Amazon.
Bee:I think it was like 5 and I think that was it.
Bee:Exactly right.
Bee:Perfect for that night.
Bee:Oh, it's already
Nathan:on VOD?
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:Oh, good.
Nathan:Yep.
Bee:So that's pretty good.
Bee:I like that.
Bee:That was a good one.
Nathan:I'm looking forward to that.
Nathan:Good.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:It's just, it's just nice to see new stories, new people, and there's
Bee:a good mix of, there's a lot of faces in that movie that you've seen
Bee:before, but there's going to be a lot of faces that you haven't too.
Sam:Nice.
Bee:Yeah.
Bee:All right.
Bee:New talent.
Sam:Let's check it out.
Bee:Yeah.
Nathan:Awesome.
Nathan:Woo!
Nathan:I think that's it for tonight.
Nathan:Rock and roll.
Nathan:Next week we are watching Lillies from 1996.
Nathan:A movie that I know nothing about and we are going to have a guest on joining us.
Nathan:We'll save that just until that actually happens, just to make sure that.
Nathan:If it's, it's legit.
Nathan:So we'll, we'll see.
Nathan:But yeah, so tune in next week when we watch and review Willie's from 1996.
Nathan:I didn't even know where it's streaming.
Nathan:We have to figure that out.
Nathan:Oh, I think it's in Criterion.
Nathan:Just hit Criterion.
Bee:It is.
Nathan:Yes.
Bee:It looks awesome.
Bee:John Grayson, the director.
Nathan:And that will be the third and final movie and our June pride series.
Nathan:Awesome.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Cool.
Nathan:So thank you for dialing into, did I do my, I don't know if I
Nathan:did, I did do my housekeeping.
Nathan:That's right.
Nathan:Back to the framerate.
Nathan:Western media.
Nathan:All right.
Nathan:Back to the framerate.
Nathan:It's part of the Western media podcast network.
Nathan:We wish to thank Brian Ellsworth for our show opening on behalf of all of us.
Nathan:We bid you farewell from our fall shelter.
Nathan:Your presence in our underground sanctuary is truly appreciated.
Nathan:We are truly sorry.
Nathan:You cannot join us.
Nathan:But we want to express our gratitude for your company.
Nathan:If you were finding solace in our discussions, we kindly ask that you
Nathan:please subscribe and leave a rating and review, you can find more episodes of
Nathan:this podcast on back to the frame rate.
Nathan:com and a handle on a bank, Sam.
Nathan:And our
Nathan:social and our socials back.
Nathan:Framerate.
Nathan:Your support is the beacon of light that brightens our confined space.
Nathan:Head on over to Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or whichever portal connects you to
Nathan:our broadcast and share your thoughts.
Nathan:Until we emerge from the fallout, stay with us, keep up live,
Nathan:and keep those reviews coming.
Nathan:Back to the framerate, signing off.
Nathan:I want you to know it's over.
Nathan:Will.
Nathan:Will.
Nathan:Bye.
Nathan:Bye.
Nathan:We got twins!
Nathan:Twins!
