The Abyss (1989)/ Misunderstood Masterpiece or Narrative Sinkhole
In this week’s episode of Back to the Frame Rate, we dive headfirst into the deep end with James Cameron’s ambitious sci-fi epic, The Abyss. We explore its groundbreaking underwater cinematography and the sheer technical wizardry that pushed filmmaking to new depths—while also calling out where the dialogue and storytelling don’t quite rise to the surface. We break down the differences between the theatrical and special edition cuts, and talk about how they each shape the film’s emotional core. We talk about our recent theater experience seeing Paul Thomas Anderson’s One Battle After Another and The Conjuring: Last Rites. Stick around for our “high pressure and low pressure” movie recommendations—perfect companions to Cameron’s underwater odyssey.
Take our Poll - Help shape the future of our Podcast!
Sign up for new online newsletter, Frame Rate Monthly. Email backtotheframerate@gmail.com to subscribe.
Find all our episodes here on your preferred Podcast app:
https://backtotheframerate.com
Back to the Frame Rate is on Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/backframerate/
Be sure to Follow us @backtotheframerate
https://www.facebook.com/backtotheframerate
https://www.instagram.com/backtotheframerate/
https://twitter.com/backframerate
https://www.tiktok.com/@backtotheframerate
https://www.youtube.com/@backtotheframerate - Where you can watch video versions
Email us at backtotheframerate@gmail.com
Follow Nathan on Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/nathansuher/
Follow Bee on Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/mambobumbles/
Copyright © Weston Media Center, Inc.
Transcript
I don't even know which is the right button.
Speaker B:Oh, we're recording right now.
Speaker A:Yeah, we're just gonna go.
Speaker A:Hey, well, you know what?
Speaker A:I don't even have my little opening.
Speaker B:Oh, oh.
Speaker A:Hold on, hold on, hold on.
Speaker B:We're in a world where destruction, Burgundy, Hurgity, Burg, you know.
Speaker A:Well, I have that.
Speaker A:No, like, welcome to back to the whole thing.
Speaker A:Like what?
Speaker B:Hold on, hold on.
Speaker A:I know.
Speaker B:Well, I gotta hear Western media something or other.
Speaker A:What is this?
Speaker A:What are we host.
Speaker A:Opening and closing.
Speaker A:Here it.
Speaker A:I did it from June 18th.
Speaker A:Here it is.
Speaker A:Welcome to Back to the Frame Rate.
Speaker A:Proud production of the Western Media podcast.
Speaker A:Okay, I got it, got it, got it.
Speaker A:All right, here we go.
Speaker A:We're gonna keep this all in.
Speaker B:That's awesome.
Speaker C:In the dying embers of human existence, as the asteroid, a behemoth the size of Texas, hurdles relentlessly toward Earth, the world braces for an apocalyptic end.
Speaker C:Deep beneath the bunker, a refuge plunges into the bowels of the ear.
Speaker C:Here the chosen gather their purpose clear to preserve the very soul of our civilization.
Speaker C:The 35 and 70 millimeter prints that encapsulate the magic, the emotion, and the dreams of generations past.
Speaker C:These masterpieces, each frame a testament to the human spirit, are carefully cataloged and cradled in the cavernous confines of the bunker.
Speaker C:Perhaps there was room for more, for friends and family yearning for salvation.
Speaker C:But sacrifices must be made.
Speaker C:The movie nerds stand united, the keepers of a flame, promising a future where the art of storytelling endures, transcending the boundaries of time and space.
Speaker C:God help us all.
Speaker A:Welcome to Back to the Frame Rate, part of the Weston Media Podcast Network.
Speaker A:In this cinematic crusade, we journey through films on VOD and streaming platforms, deciding their fate, salvation in our vault of legends, or eternal banishment in the flames of the coming asteroid apocalypse.
Speaker A:We're still waiting.
Speaker A:You can find all of our episodes of our show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast app or.
Speaker A:And find us on social media at Back to the Frame Rate.
Speaker A:I'm Nathan Shore, and accompany me tonight is Sam Cole.
Speaker B:Nathan, it is a pleasure to be here, and I just wanted to say that it fills my soul with mirth and joyful merriment to return here.
Speaker B:We are, back to.
Speaker B:To the Frame Rate yet again.
Speaker A:Yeah, we are going Back to Back to the Frame Rate.
Speaker A:Very inceptiony.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker A:Well, no, it's been a good four months since we've sat here at the mics talking about movies.
Speaker A:It's good to be back.
Speaker A:And we've.
Speaker A:I think so we, we've been talking for about a month about what we're going to do to, to bring some episodes back.
Speaker A:And we decided that, you know, in a few months Avatar 3 is coming out.
Speaker A:But what could we do to like tie that all together?
Speaker A:And one idea was to do the entire Avatar franchise and like, you know, does anyone really need to hear more Avatar talk?
Speaker A:You know.
Speaker A:But we're both excited for the third film.
Speaker A:But this became like an opportunity to go back and talk about some of Jim Cameron's earlier films.
Speaker A:But I loved the idea of going into some of his like non franchise films, some of the ones that maybe aren't really thought about talked about as much.
Speaker A:So like here we are tonight talking about the abyss.
Speaker A:And this is exciting because this is a, a film that I haven't seen in ages and up until this past week confession, I've never even, I never even saw the special edition.
Speaker A:So I watched both in the past week or so.
Speaker A:So this is pretty cool.
Speaker A:And coming up also the, the second film in our Cameron retrospective is going to be True Lies coming out in a couple weeks or a month or so.
Speaker A:So we've got a little mini Cameron marathon.
Speaker A:But this is cool.
Speaker A:This is our first James Cameron film that we're talking about on the show.
Speaker A:I'm excited about this so I'm going to.
Speaker A:I have a plot synopsis here and a trailer.
Speaker A:Let me just go through this quickly.
Speaker A:We'll get into a little bit about the film here.
Speaker A:But the plot synopsis is Ed Harris and Mary Elizabeth Master Mastanio.
Speaker A:Is that how you say it?
Speaker B:Antonio or Antonio Master Mastro?
Speaker A:Antonio are formally married petroleum engineers who still have some issues to work out.
Speaker A:They, they are drafted to assist a gung ho Navy SEAL team headed by Michael Bean with a top secret recovery operation.
Speaker A:A nuclear sub has ambushed, has been ambushed and sunk under mysterious circumstances in some of the deepest waters on earth.
Speaker A:And here is.
Speaker A:Well, yeah, I was gonna, I was about to say I was gonna play a part of the trailer, but I don't know if Sammy, you're familiar with this finding a trailer of this film.
Speaker A:I don't remember if there is an official trailer for this because I find I'm finding a lot of like those like modern trailer mashups.
Speaker A: railer of this film back from: Speaker A:Whereas like Jim Cameron brought you the most greatest sci fi movie ever in the Terminator and then Aliens and here I'm just going to play it because it's hysterical.
Speaker B: In: Speaker A:With his vision of the future, the Terminator.
Speaker A: In: Speaker A:This summer, he will take you into.
Speaker B:A world no man has ever seen before.
Speaker C:The Abyss.
Speaker A:Believe your eyes.
Speaker A:Well, I'm sold.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's.
Speaker B:It's like this summer, forget the past two films.
Speaker B:This one will blow them out of the mother effing water.
Speaker A:Yeah, this is the only real like original trailer teaser I could find from 89.
Speaker A:So there's that.
Speaker A:I was kind of surprised.
Speaker A:I thought there was like a real like trailer for this, but I could not find anything.
Speaker B:Honestly.
Speaker B:That's the only one that I found.
Speaker B:I wasn't able to find any others as well.
Speaker B: his came out in the summer of: Speaker A:Batman around this time too.
Speaker B:Batman same summer.
Speaker B:License to Kill.
Speaker B:James Bond, that also did not do that great.
Speaker B:But this movie was actually scheduled to come out early in the summer, like I think as early as like Memorial Day weekend.
Speaker B:And they were sort of over budget and delayed.
Speaker B:So it came out way towards the end in August.
Speaker B:And even I don't for this particular recording, even though I don't have movie facts prepared.
Speaker B:I know apparently there I haven't seen this film.
Speaker B:But there was another movie that came out earlier that year called Leviathan.
Speaker B:Oh, that, that apparently, apparently.
Speaker B:And, and correct me if I'm wrong, it didn't get the best reviews.
Speaker B:And so I feel like when this came out audiences were kind of like, oh man, another like underwater movie.
Speaker B:But I am surprised that this didn't have more box office pull.
Speaker B:But it was certainly was not a failure.
Speaker B:But this is not a like mega James Cameron hit.
Speaker B:Like it was solid, it did well.
Speaker B:Cult following on vhs.
Speaker B:But it looked like you had thoughts on that.
Speaker B:That was.
Speaker B:I just was just remembering that.
Speaker A: s deeper than that because in: Speaker A:And I think this, from what I was reading this probably spurred a whole slew of underwater adventure films.
Speaker A: And Leviathan in: Speaker A:You had Leviathan, you had the Abyss, you had Deep Star 6, if you remember that movie.
Speaker B:I remember the poster for that as a young kid.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And there was another one that was much more low budget called Lords of the Deep.
Speaker A:All of these came out in like a four or five month span of time.
Speaker A:And all like, like horror, underwater adventure movies.
Speaker A:And the Abyss, though, was pretty cagey about what it was about.
Speaker A:I remember in the trailer, you know, that I just played kind of like explains it.
Speaker A:Although the trailer, if I kept playing it at the very end of it, mentions that it's not only an adventure, it's also a love story.
Speaker A:And it was like, what.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Or.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:But really confusing like, what is this movie about?
Speaker A:But I think there's a lot of marketing that was surrounding it while it was being.
Speaker A:Before it was coming out because I remember Ed Harris and James Cameron getting out on the Tonight show or stuff, talking about this film because I remember all the state of the art technology and the giant sets that were being constructed in like a nuclear reactor.
Speaker A:This was a huge story.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:They made this movie probably bigger than the movie itself in a lot of ways.
Speaker A:But yeah, this is.
Speaker A:So all these movies are coming out around this time.
Speaker A:So this was.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was a weird time for all these underwater adventures.
Speaker A:There might have been other.
Speaker A:I think there was later in the 90s or more like Deep Rising and Hard Rain and there was more of these disaster movies and stuff.
Speaker B:I hear that.
Speaker B:I wonder if audiences might have maybe felt a little inundated by it.
Speaker B:But this is just in terms of the actual location, this was one thing that I had remembered to mention.
Speaker B:I'm just reading this.
Speaker B:Underwater sequences for the film were shot at a unit of the Gaffney studio situated south of Cherokee Falls, outside Gaffney, South Carolina, which had been abandoned by Duke Power officials.
Speaker B:So it was that huge tank, the nuclear power plant where they filmed all of it.
Speaker B:That's really impressive that they.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Kind of just took over that whole.
Speaker A:Thing and like water, like largest underwater set ever used on a film at the time.
Speaker A:I don't know if.
Speaker A:Well, I'm guessing since then there have been.
Speaker A:Maybe Titanic was bigger.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:I can't imagine how claustrophobic it was filming some of that stuff under that.
Speaker B:I mean, just my own, you know, personal feelings of like, just.
Speaker B:My God, you know, so.
Speaker A:Oh, one other thing I wanted to mention about this, you know, I.
Speaker A:One of the.
Speaker A:I think the best parts of this movie Is this movie has some incredible sound design.
Speaker A:I think.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker A:I remember when.
Speaker A:I don't know if it was like THX or whatever one of the Dolby platforms was released this.
Speaker A:When I got a good sound system back in mid-90s or 96 or 97, I ran out and I remember getting this on letterbox VHS that had the surround sound and I.
Speaker A:And I remember getting this back then.
Speaker A:It was the theatrical version, of course, but it was so important for me.
Speaker A:I bought.
Speaker A:I remember going to Suncoast Video and getting this and probably like Terminator 2 and I don't know what else.
Speaker A:I think it was like Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade or maybe the box set at the time.
Speaker A:Those were like five or six movies I purchased at the time.
Speaker A:And it was so important for me to.
Speaker A:I wanted.
Speaker A:And I had all the speaker setups in my.
Speaker A:In my house.
Speaker A:And this was one of the ones I remember buying at the time at Suncoast.
Speaker B:Oh my God, that must have been great for that.
Speaker B:I mean just everything like the.
Speaker B:The dialogue through the helmets, the bubbles, the sound of like dripping water, the environment.
Speaker B:Like I think this, I could be wrong, but this may won best sound editing in Oscar for the Oscars.
Speaker A:I think I actually did keep track.
Speaker A:I wanted to make a note of the.
Speaker A:The awards that it won.
Speaker A:This was nominated for four Academy Awards.
Speaker A: In the: Speaker A:Lost to Batman was nominated for sound.
Speaker A:But Lost to glory and also Lost, also Lost to Glory for best cinematography.
Speaker B:I could see that.
Speaker B:I could totally see that on the cinematography.
Speaker B:The special effects were great.
Speaker B:I mean for then.
Speaker B:I mean.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Now this had a budget of 43 to 47 million and it looks like worldwide actually domestic gross was 55 million and worldwide total was just over 90 million.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeah, you know, did okay.
Speaker A:Not.
Speaker A:Not great.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was okay.
Speaker B:It wasn't like a disaster.
Speaker B:It was just kind of like.
Speaker B:Like sort of lukewarm.
Speaker B:You know, it was.
Speaker B:I think it was like set up to be like a mega.
Speaker B: e they were hoping for summer: Speaker B:The abyss.
Speaker A:You know, some of the people that worked obviously, you know, Jim Cameron directed, wrote, was the writer of this and music Alan Silvestri.
Speaker A:I think this is one of his most underrated scores.
Speaker B:I love the score.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's great.
Speaker A:I mean, of course most people know him from like Back to the Future.
Speaker A:Predator is.
Speaker A:I love Predator so much.
Speaker A:No one ever talks about Sergeant Bilko, but whatever I saw that in the theater actually.
Speaker A:But yeah, this is.
Speaker A:And now he's.
Speaker A:He's just doing Marvel stuff now, I feel like, you know.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Mikal Solman.
Speaker B:Ah, the cinematographer.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Same year he did Spielberg's always yay callback.
Speaker B:Really?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Ellie Escobaro, we love you.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So some of the cast in this, we got Ed Harris as Bud Rigman.
Speaker A:We talked about Mary Elizabeth mastrin tanio as Dr. Lindsey Brigman, Michael Bean, Lieutenant Coffey.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:So it's some intense acting.
Speaker A:Those eyes, that mustache was.
Speaker B:Damn, was he intense.
Speaker B:I really noticed that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Leo Burmester is Catfish in this.
Speaker B:Oh, gotcha.
Speaker A:Yep, I liked him in this.
Speaker A:Now there we got John Bedford Lloyd as Jammer.
Speaker A:Todd Graff as hippie.
Speaker A:Kimberly Scott as.
Speaker A:I love the names that they gave some of these characters that plays One Night, but her last name is standing in this.
Speaker A:So she's One Night standing in this.
Speaker A:And what the hell.
Speaker A:Chris Elliot is in this movie.
Speaker B:I was just.
Speaker B:I love Chris Elliot.
Speaker B:And I was.
Speaker B:It's funny, when I was watching it, I was thinking if this was modern times and that movie was hugely successful, the benthic explorer, the boat, like up on the surface would get its own spin off show.
Speaker B:Like before they helped the riggers.
Speaker B:Like here's them like doing other stuff and it's like an eight episode episode miniseries about Chris Elliott on the ship.
Speaker A:The sad thing is I can't see Chris Elliott without ever thinking of that show we used to have called Get a Life.
Speaker A:I don't remember if you ever saw that back in.
Speaker B:Oh my God, I haven't thought about that in years.
Speaker B:I barely remember that.
Speaker B:But I think I did see that one.
Speaker A:Yeah, I've never gotten over that show.
Speaker A:But I love Chris Elliott.
Speaker A:But I totally forgot he was in this.
Speaker A:Playing a very, you know, normal, for the most part, like straight guy.
Speaker B:So whatever he was, I just love it when he's like when he.
Speaker B:When they on the ship and the hurricane is coming and he's like rocking back and forth in his chair for some reason that very much amuses me.
Speaker A:And I mean, one other note here.
Speaker A:Ken Jenkins plays Gerard Kirkhill who later on goes on to play Dr. Kelso and Scrubs.
Speaker A:I love seeing him in this.
Speaker B:Oh yeah, it was great seeing him.
Speaker B:Yeah, I thought he, I thought he just fit in really well into the world of the movie.
Speaker B:Like, I totally accept that he was there.
Speaker B:I was like, oh, there he is.
Speaker B:Yeah, I hadn't seen it in a long time as well.
Speaker B: t came out on VHS, I think in: Speaker B:And so it was strange watching it again because I was reconnect.
Speaker B:I was remembering what it felt like to watch it then, but seeing it through my adult eyes.
Speaker B:And so when the ship, when the, when the submarine is mysteriously attacked.
Speaker B:When I was a little kid, a lot of, you know, I got the gist of the plot, but I was like a nine year old.
Speaker B:So obviously there's like nuances that I missed.
Speaker B:Like when Mary Elizabeth Master Antonio is talking about a tax audit I had.
Speaker B:I mean, I didn't know what the hell that was, you know, but I didn't realize, oh well, maybe the aliens attacked the ship.
Speaker B:I mean, attacked the submarine because it had nuclear weapons on it.
Speaker B:And they're like, they don't like that.
Speaker B:They're threatened by that.
Speaker B:So they flew past, you know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, there was subtleties that I noticed that I went way over my head as a young kid because I like you have have not seen this movie in years.
Speaker A:Did you.
Speaker A:We.
Speaker A:Did you always watch the theatrical or the special edition?
Speaker B:Growing up, I watched the theatrical, but then I saw the special edition later on.
Speaker B:And I recently watched both Special Edition and Theatrical.
Speaker B:So I've definitely, I'm definitely familiar with both of them.
Speaker B:Probably more so theatrical just because I watched that so many times that there were certain scenes where I was more remembering what it felt like watching it in my living room as a kid than like re experiencing it again.
Speaker B:It was a very strange viewing because it was like going into the past and the present.
Speaker B:It was interesting, surprising for me in some ways.
Speaker A:I've only watched the theatrical version my whole life and it's in the last like 10 years.
Speaker A:I read so much about how the special edition fixes all the problems with this movie and like why.
Speaker A:And I've always put.
Speaker A:Put off watching again because it's like two hours and like 50 minutes.
Speaker B:I'm like, oh yeah, almost a three hour film.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I'll say though, I'm not gonna get into it yet because we'll get to the ending a little bit later, our discussion.
Speaker A:But I'll say though, just to spoil a little bit, I. I don't think it fixes many of the, the majority, the majority of the issues I have with this movie.
Speaker A:I think that the, the ending does have a lot of issues.
Speaker B:And I agree with you a thousand percent.
Speaker A:And it does add gravitas somehow, but at the most part, my issues aren't so much with that.
Speaker A:It has a lot to do actually with the overall.
Speaker A:Some of the, some of the, the.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The story and the script in this and some of the acting I think is.
Speaker A:I have a real problem.
Speaker B:Oh boy, I hear you.
Speaker B:And I'm surprised because I, as a kid, I was just.
Speaker B:I loved action as a kid.
Speaker B:And as a kid I'd watch it with my friends, oh, here comes the scene with the water and they're sinking in the door and blah, blah, blah.
Speaker B:And now I was watching it, like, story, character, and it was a.
Speaker B:Just a very different experience.
Speaker B:This is almost shockingly different for me, to be quite honest.
Speaker A:Yeah, there's.
Speaker A:There's a lot of uneven performances in this and uneven writing.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:First of all, I mean, I'll say right off the bat, I think Ed Harris and Mary Elizabeth Mastering Antonio are fantastic.
Speaker A:And this.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:None of my problems with this movie are with them.
Speaker A:I think Ed Harris is fantastic.
Speaker A:I wish Ed Harris had done more like action films.
Speaker A:I did remind me of like, how good he is like movies like the Rock and things like that, but I think that Ed Harris is fantastic.
Speaker A:I have a problem with like the, the other grunts in this movie, which I don't think Cameron did a good job.
Speaker A:He wrote the script and I don't think he did a really good job like writing like authentic dialogue for these characters.
Speaker A:I find I found it to be just like cringe worthy some of this.
Speaker A:And Sam, I captured some of it for our show because I think.
Speaker A:I think that some of it is just facepalm.
Speaker A:The way that some of these guys talk to each other and the exposition that is dumped in this and the way that it's so stilted.
Speaker A:There was one character, and I know everyone.
Speaker A:I don't like to like, you know, just really pile on a performance of one actor, but I could not think about the performance of the character of hippie Todd Graff, who is like, I wouldn't call him necessarily comic relief in this movie, but he is the character who just cannot shut up about everything that's going on around him in this movie.
Speaker B:Is he the one?
Speaker B:Honestly, this is almost embarrassing, but some of them don't leave much of an impression and I can.
Speaker B:Is he the one that has the conspiracy theories for y.
Speaker B:Everything?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And that the one line I did like, when, when.
Speaker B:When she.
Speaker B:When Mary Elizabeth is like, you think everything is a conspiracy.
Speaker B:And he's like, that's because everything is.
Speaker B:Yes, that's the one line I was like, that was good.
Speaker A:But I, I'll, I'll play this clip, these series of clips here because I, I think that it just kind of showcases some of the, the weakness in some of the dialogue in here.
Speaker B:Sir, we have a proximity warning light.
Speaker B:It's too damn close.
Speaker B:We gotta back off to 130 knots.
Speaker B:Sir, nothing goes 130.
Speaker B:What is all this stuff?
Speaker A:Fluid breathing system.
Speaker A:We just got them.
Speaker A:You use it when you go really deep.
Speaker A:How deep?
Speaker C:Deep.
Speaker A:How deep?
Speaker A:It's classified.
Speaker A:Can I borrow your rat?
Speaker A:What are you doing?
Speaker B:Hey, hey, hey.
Speaker B:No, no, no, no.
Speaker A:You're gonna kill her.
Speaker B:It's okay.
Speaker A:I've done this myself.
Speaker B:Oh man.
Speaker A:What are you just drowning her?
Speaker B:He's got be fine.
Speaker A:I breathed this myself.
Speaker A:Going to be fine.
Speaker A:No, man, she's going to drown.
Speaker A:Look, look, she's freaking out.
Speaker B:Just going through a normal adjustment period.
Speaker B:Normal?
Speaker A:Does this look normal to you?
Speaker A:She's going to drown.
Speaker A:It's got to be some kind of emergency plan to keep it away from the Russians, right?
Speaker A:Look, look.
Speaker A:They hotwire one of the nukes.
Speaker A:They use some kind of detonator that they brought.
Speaker B:Then they stick it back in the.
Speaker A:Sub, fry the whole thing up.
Speaker A:Bam.
Speaker A:Slicker and snide.
Speaker A:What is he doing?
Speaker A:He can't make it to the door.
Speaker A:He's gonna try and take him out himself.
Speaker A:God, he couldn't be that dumb.
Speaker B:That guy's a trained killer.
Speaker A:Coming up on the Big Ten foul.
Speaker A:12,000ft.
Speaker A:Jesus.
Speaker A:I don't believe he's doing this.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:It's funny when you hear it all together like that, it's like, oof.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:But I see the thing is, I don't think like people working on this rig would talk like this.
Speaker A:Like it's, It's.
Speaker B:So there's a. I don'.
Speaker B:I know what you mean.
Speaker B:There's almost like.
Speaker B:There's a self awareness of.
Speaker B:I don't quite know how to put a finger on it, but it's almost like they're like a little too self aware of the plot or their plot.
Speaker B:You know what's interesting?
Speaker B:I will say cameras are on.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:As much as I enjoy Avatar, I would go far as to say that I find the dialogue and an Avatar clunkier than this film.
Speaker B:Like some of this.
Speaker B:Because Cameron, I mean I'm obviously a huge James Cameron fan, but he seems, he's very comfortable in the world of like military personnel or like, you know, like working class.
Speaker B:Like Oil like he seems okay at that.
Speaker B:But I know what you mean about the.
Speaker B:The dialogue draws attention to himself, I feel, you know, here's what it is.
Speaker B:I feel it's James Cameron trying to get his ideas across through the characters.
Speaker B:So all the dialogue sometimes sounds like him trying to think what he thinks he thinks these people would say, if that makes sense.
Speaker B:I know what you're saying.
Speaker B:I don't know if I'm explaining that well, but I definitely hear you.
Speaker A:Yeah, I get it.
Speaker A:But it just seems.
Speaker A:It's such a clunky way of storytelling when there's so much great atmosphere and you've got some really good actors in this.
Speaker A:That why isn't the.
Speaker A:There's so many better ways of telling the story through this atmosphere and the actors just emoting and that's not what this movie is.
Speaker A:But it just seems like there's so many effective ways and he's done this so much better in other films.
Speaker B:Do you think here he might be showing and not, I mean, I'm sorry.
Speaker B:That he might be telling.
Speaker B:He's telling but not showing.
Speaker B:Like he's kind of trying.
Speaker B:It feels like there's.
Speaker B:He's overdoing it.
Speaker B:It's like, oh my gosh.
Speaker B:Like nothing goes 180.
Speaker B:Or it's like, oh my gosh, hey, you're gonna hurt my rat.
Speaker B:And it's like.
Speaker B:But we can already see that he's putting your rat into the liquid.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's all I'm see.
Speaker A:Yeah, 100% exactly.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's a really good point.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I'm just wondering like, because I didn't feel like I, you know, when I see the movie Aliens or like there was not this.
Speaker A:I mean that was.
Speaker A:Also had a series of writers on it, like Walter Hill and other people there were probably doctoring a lot of the stuff.
Speaker B:Well, that's the thing.
Speaker B:But the thing about Aliens is the characters in that movie, they say things that you'd think the character would say.
Speaker B:So it feels more organic.
Speaker B:I would even go as far to say is there are multiple writers on Avatar 2 and the dialogue in the second Avatar film for me is preferable to the first one.
Speaker B:Yes, there's cringy moments, but there is some mega cringe in the first Avatar.
Speaker B:There's some kind of line of like they're Jake, they're, you know, they're building some kind of shock and awe campaign and they're like, oh man, those friggin Daisy cutters.
Speaker B:Or they've got a line that's like, hey, Jake, we have to record our thoughts because remember, good science is good observation.
Speaker B:And you're like, dude.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's annoying.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, I think.
Speaker A:I think it just could be that this was.
Speaker A:Might be his first go around as being the solo writer on.
Speaker A:On a film and he just wasn't.
Speaker A:Wasn't really.
Speaker A:Nobody was telling him.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Who knows?
Speaker B:But I hear that, like, some of the.
Speaker B:Some of it doesn't bother me as.
Speaker B:As much, but I know.
Speaker B:I feel exactly what you're saying.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:A couple other things is the, the overall storytelling.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:This is a.
Speaker A:Just a.
Speaker A:An odd film as well.
Speaker A:I mean, it is.
Speaker A:It's science fiction.
Speaker A:It is a love story.
Speaker A:It is this standoff about this nuclear.
Speaker A:It's a nuclear standoff with the Russians, the Americans that we never really see.
Speaker A:The Russians also.
Speaker A:And this alien entity that is very cryptic of what its motivations are.
Speaker A:It is, right.
Speaker A:Really.
Speaker A:It's really hard to.
Speaker A:Especially in the, the theatrical cut, which, yeah.
Speaker A:Really never explains if you've never seen the, The.
Speaker A:The extended cut.
Speaker A:It really leaves you perplexed.
Speaker A:Like, what was that all about?
Speaker B:Completely in the dark.
Speaker B:And that literally, I mean, with what you're saying about the dialogue that ties directly into the thing about this movie.
Speaker B:Because when I was watching it, I was entertained and I was kind of liking it.
Speaker B:But I had this underlying feeling of what is it about this movie that isn't quite working for me?
Speaker B:I couldn't quite articulate it.
Speaker B:Then it came to me and I was like, this is what it is.
Speaker B:This, to me seems more a movie of a bunch of multiple ideas rather than a fully cohesive story.
Speaker B:It almost seems to me like James Cameron loves the ocean.
Speaker B:He loves underwater.
Speaker B:He loves military stuff.
Speaker B:He likes sci fi.
Speaker B:So I feel like there's all these kind of not necessarily conflicting ideas, but it's like he's.
Speaker B:He's putting all the things into the movie that he wants to see, but they don't quite coalesce together in a way that Terminator 2 really does, or Aliens really, really does.
Speaker B:Those movies really work.
Speaker B:This movie is less than the sum of its parts, in my opinion.
Speaker A:Yeah, I agree with that for sure.
Speaker A:And again, I'm.
Speaker A:I feel like I'm dumping on this a lot, but.
Speaker B:No, no, it's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Another thing I want to point out is I have some frustrations just with the inconsistencies on the rules of survival in this movie, which I find just perplexing.
Speaker A:There is all this there's several moments in this movie there's all this concern about freezing to death when the heaters went down.
Speaker A:And Bud goes for a swim in 35 degree water.
Speaker B:He goes for a swim.
Speaker B:And how deep are they when he goes to a swim?
Speaker B:Like, wouldn't that kill him?
Speaker A:He's exposed to crushing pressure and there are they 2,000ft underwater or something like that.
Speaker A:And he'd be dead mangled.
Speaker A:I mean, if.
Speaker A:And at the very least his eardrums would be punctured, his eyeballs would be punctured.
Speaker A:Like the, The.
Speaker A:The crushing pressure going out there without a suit, just.
Speaker A:There's no way that these people would survive.
Speaker A:It has nothing even really to do with the temperature.
Speaker A:Yes, hypothermia would.
Speaker A:Would set in very shortly after coming out.
Speaker A:Just the pressure alone.
Speaker A:Their lungs, their eardrums, their eyeballs would absolutely implode in the.
Speaker A:In that depth, and I know it.
Speaker A:Hey, it's a movie.
Speaker A:Suspend your disbelief.
Speaker A:I get it.
Speaker A:But when, but when you set the rules that they need these suits to begin with to survive, and then they can just, like, abandon this.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I, I do have problems with that, with when we can just bend the rules.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And we're supposed to be kind of a movie about science in some ways, you know.
Speaker B:Well, that's the thing.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And I'm all about suspending disbelief, but this is a situation where it kind of aggressively shows itself and you're like, wait a minute.
Speaker B:You can't not pay attention to it.
Speaker B:There's this movie, I will say it has some decent recent plants and payoffs in it.
Speaker B:Like when Ed Harris throws his ring into the toilet and it, like, saves his ring, his hand from being crushed.
Speaker B:Or when.
Speaker A:No, his hand is blue the entire movie.
Speaker B:Or like, I love it when the guy is like, you see my fist?
Speaker B:I used to call this the hammer.
Speaker B:And then he's the one that punches Michael Bean.
Speaker B:So we've established these strong.
Speaker B:But there are also manufactured things designed to create action sequences.
Speaker B:So, for example, the rig is connected to the Benthic explorer via that cable.
Speaker B:Now when Coffee gets his orders to, you know, go and get the nuke, he just leaves.
Speaker B:And they could have solved that in a second.
Speaker B:But because of that, that's the whole reason why he leaves.
Speaker B:And they can't detach the cable, so then the.
Speaker B:Then the cable falls.
Speaker B:And the thing, to me, I feel like Cameron, I can feel him working hard on the script to find ways to mine action and drama, where some of them feel organic, but some of it feels like sort of manufactured situations where it just, I can feel the screenwriting effort.
Speaker B:Like oh, how can I get this action scene in here?
Speaker B:Oh, this has to connect to this.
Speaker B:But that, the one, the whole reason for the umbilical cord thing that seemed manufactured because coffee is this like.
Speaker B:I mean of course he's secretive so he wouldn't have told the oil, the drillers but I just felt a little bit of like screenwriting cheating on that one kind of just.
Speaker B:But also considering that at the moment I'm like heavily involved in writing so I'm a hyper aware of.
Speaker B:Because I struggle with the same thing.
Speaker B:So when I see it in a movie like that, I'm like, oh, that, that could have been better, that kind of thing.
Speaker A:He seems to also abandon the, the, the, the, the need for stakes in this movie as well.
Speaker A:Like in this, in the last act of this movie.
Speaker A:I, I know it's, it's, it's almost like a throwaway mention about how there is a, this nuke is going to set to go off in three hours, right?
Speaker A:I, I, I, I forgot all about this, that there, that Ed Harris is going down to defuse this.
Speaker A:But it's mentioned like one time in a very casual way that it's, that this nuke's gonna like go off and I forgot that this is, there's a time limit on this.
Speaker A:It's never mentioned again this, there's never a ticking clock on this whole thing, right?
Speaker A:It's never mentioned that hey, they're running out of oxygen or they're gonna freeze.
Speaker A:There's no like urgency.
Speaker A:It's a very casual descent down this, this, this wall that is going down and it's, it's very, it's interesting choice of Cameron to write it this way and with no real panic in this whole thing.
Speaker A:Like is he gonna make it?
Speaker A:And there's, there's no real climax because of that.
Speaker A:Like where is like.
Speaker A:And I, I find that interesting that this is how it's, it's, it's really just an unusual way because we, we could have had a film where there's like the nuke is going to go off and the, the people on the rig are running low on oxygen and is he going to this instant?
Speaker A:But there's also this silly thing where he is like, you can't like tell like which chord to cut, which I can't stand at all.
Speaker A:But because like you know he's gonna cut the right chord.
Speaker B:You know, it'd be funny if he, if he cut the Wrong one.
Speaker B:And the screen went black like the end of the Sopranos and it just.
Speaker A:Went to the credits.
Speaker A:Credits.
Speaker B:But that's the thing, that's what I mean about the manufactured.
Speaker B:I feel like there's a lot of action in this movie.
Speaker B:I almost get this sense that Cameron himself felt that there was a lack of tension and drama.
Speaker B:And so I feel like a lot of action scenes in this movie are trying to gin it up where there's not, not quite a lot of tension there.
Speaker B:So he's like, oh, okay, I'm gonna do this thing where the cable falls and then they almost get pulled off of the abyss off the cliff by being pulled into it.
Speaker B:And then I'm gonna do this thing where the compartment floods with water.
Speaker B:Now I'm gonna do a thing where, okay, they're, they're, they have no more electricity, they're gonna freeze to death.
Speaker B:But they, these things kind of, they're planted and paid off, but they tend to go nowhere.
Speaker B:I will say too, all those little.
Speaker A:Set pieces were so much more tense than anything that happened in, in the third act.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:They and of themselves, but they're kind of isolated.
Speaker B:I actually, when they were creeping up on the submarine, on the, on the sunken submarine, though that was visually really cool.
Speaker B:It reminded me of Ripley and her team and aliens arriving on the planet.
Speaker B:And I was like, my God, when I saw the scene with the submarine, it made me almost wish I was watching aliens.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:I, I, Sam, I wrote exactly the same note down that this, this is definitely reminiscent of Aliens.
Speaker A:In fact, all of the way he shot this, which I think is, it's gorgeous film and beautiful looking the way they shot underwater in, in these corridors, in these hallways, in the subs, in these rigs.
Speaker A:It reminded me so much of Aliens and.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And Terminator all the way that he shot this.
Speaker A:It's gorgeous.
Speaker A:It looks.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:And you, and you told me, I mean you, you speak of the ticking clock and the tension.
Speaker B:Aliens does that so much better because when they have a shootout with the aliens, they rupture that the nuclear station and the power plant is gonna blow up.
Speaker B:Like in Aliens.
Speaker B:I feel the pressure.
Speaker B:I'm like, oh my God, how are they gonna get out of there?
Speaker B:This one kind of narratively meanders around sort of.
Speaker B:It's like, it's, I feel like there's.
Speaker B:That's what I mean about the story not quite coalescing.
Speaker B:There's a lot of good pieces, but it never comes together into the pulse pounding experience that you hope it will Be.
Speaker B:Be.
Speaker B:I will say one thing.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:A quick aside.
Speaker B:I was.
Speaker B:Now, years later, since I've seen it, I was much more impressed with Michael Behan's performance.
Speaker B:He actually scared me.
Speaker B:Like, I thought he kind of.
Speaker B:I was impressed by his performance.
Speaker B:I thought he was pretty good.
Speaker B:It did seem like he went from like, zero to all of a sudden 100 between, like, two scenes.
Speaker B:And, like, when we come back, he's, like, already losing it.
Speaker B:But I did like his acting.
Speaker B:I just wanted to mention that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah, he is really good in this.
Speaker A:I actually, like.
Speaker A:Actually, I love everybody in his team.
Speaker A:Even the.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The two guys that are.
Speaker A:With the.
Speaker A:With the Navy.
Speaker A:I think they're.
Speaker A:They're.
Speaker A:They are the most consistently consistent performances in this movie.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:Yeah, the other guys, the guy that gets injured, I think he's really good.
Speaker A:I forget their names.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think his team is solid.
Speaker B:Yeah, no, the two.
Speaker B:They were great.
Speaker B:And then when, like, Like, I. I was surprised when, like, Jammer wakes up from his coma.
Speaker B:Like, how does he have any idea what's going on?
Speaker B:All of a sudden, he knocks out those guys.
Speaker B:It's like, wait a minute, you just woke up from a coma?
Speaker B:Wouldn't you be like, what the fuck is going on around here?
Speaker B:You know?
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, there.
Speaker A:There's a.
Speaker A:There's a lot of.
Speaker A:A lot of shorthand storytelling.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:All throughout this whole thing.
Speaker B:This movie is very.
Speaker B:Is episodic.
Speaker B:I don't know if that's the right word, but it's like a bunch of sequences kind of.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:I really noticed that with.
Speaker B:And as a kid, I wouldn't have noticed that because I was just dazzled by all the hardware and the visual effects and, you know, that kind of thing.
Speaker A:All right, let's talk about the ending for a little bit here, because I think that this is where the.
Speaker A:The theatrical and the special edition differentiate the most.
Speaker A:I mean, I'll be honest.
Speaker A:There really wasn't anything that.
Speaker A:I mean, There's, I think, 30 minutes or 25 minutes added footage in the special edition.
Speaker A:Yeah, I can't even remember that.
Speaker A:Anything that.
Speaker A:Besides the ending that added anything.
Speaker B: I agree with you: Speaker B:The ending was the only thing that made an impression because that's a real, like, whole big scene with huge visual effects, especially for the time.
Speaker B:But the rest of it is like, you know, Ed Harris and Mary Elizabeth Master.
Speaker B:They have more dialogue and there's a couple more scenes.
Speaker B:It's, like, slowed down a bit, but.
Speaker A:Aside from the end musical number That I didn't expect.
Speaker B:That's true.
Speaker A:Thank God that was cut out.
Speaker B:Oh my God, that was ridiculous.
Speaker B:But like, I, it, I agree.
Speaker B:The special edition, like, you know, you, you go online and the consensus is, oh, the special edition is like much better.
Speaker B:But my thoughts were like.
Speaker B:It was, yeah.
Speaker B:I mean the ending was interesting, but I'll let you speak because even I had problems with the ending.
Speaker B:Well, tell me your thoughts because I, I.
Speaker B:Regarding the special edition ending.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker B:In some ways it almost irritates me a little bit.
Speaker B:I'll just go as far as to say that I find it a little not preachy.
Speaker B:But again, there's, it's, it's not as if it's sappy, but the whole thing with the, with the aliens, like, we're gonna kill all of you, except.
Speaker B:But then we read one text and for the love of his wife.
Speaker B:And then there's that when the, they're rising up to the surface.
Speaker B:And there's that really cheesy line way back up on the Benthic explorer where the guy is like, like, guess the military is not needed anymore, huh?
Speaker B:Or something.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:To me, it feels like James Cameron's ideas, but it doesn't quite coalesce.
Speaker B:I don't buy what's actually happening.
Speaker A:Like, well, my problem is the, the message was received by only one man who communicating and that was Ed Harris underwater.
Speaker A:Everyone else on the planet is losing their minds.
Speaker B:Yeah, they're like, what the hell is going on here?
Speaker B:It's like a freaking mile high tsunami.
Speaker A:Like that just stops in the middle of about the destroying all civilization.
Speaker A:What is the takeaway from everybody on this planet?
Speaker A:Do they even know that the aliens had anything to do with this?
Speaker A:All I know is that with the United States in Russia and all these superpowers and how trigger happy we are, this probably only started World War iii because yeah, they're probably assuming, the United States is probably assuming that this is a Russian advanced super weapon and vice versa.
Speaker A:Were launching nukes immediately at whatever this.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker B:And did you notice how everyone on the ship is so happy to see the aliens?
Speaker B:Why would that in real life, they would be like, Jesus Christ, what's going on?
Speaker A:I'm pushing the nuke button immediately.
Speaker A:At this point.
Speaker B:Yeah, they would like, you think they were panicking before with the Russians.
Speaker B:They would like, they would like freaking go crazy with this.
Speaker B:That was so man.
Speaker A:Except for Chris Elliott, who is having the time of his life watching this.
Speaker B:Like, yes, like he's, this is awesome.
Speaker B:But it's like, no, this is the.
Speaker A:End of your life is probably what.
Speaker B:Everyone'S thinking, but too many things happen for the sake of convenience.
Speaker B:It's almost like this is.
Speaker B:With the screenwriting process.
Speaker B:I feel like James Cameron was like, wait a minute, couldn't the ship on the surface just rescue them?
Speaker B:Okay, okay, I know what I'll do.
Speaker B:I'll put a big hurricane in so they can't talk to each other.
Speaker B:There's a whole bunch of happenstance stuff that gives him the excuse to do the scenes that he wants to do do.
Speaker B:Like there's too much circumstantial nonsense in this movie.
Speaker B:And it was.
Speaker B:I was surprised at how aggressive it was.
Speaker B:This feeling.
Speaker B:I. I'll be honest.
Speaker B:Like, I was like, b.
Speaker B:B plus entertainment.
Speaker B:Like, I was enjoying it.
Speaker B:But, man, was this a different experience for me watching this again.
Speaker B:Like, surprisingly so.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, but, but, but like the special edition at the end that I. I must say, though, one thing I have to praise.
Speaker B:I thought the special effects were very impressive.
Speaker B:James Cameron's attention to visual detail, like, even the tsunami, even though it was very old school, I thought that looked great.
Speaker B:I thought the CGI water tentacle, even though it's like kind of CGI in its infancy, looked pretty good.
Speaker B:I do remember in the theater at the time, I saw it with my dad and my friend, and when the water tentacle came out of the moon pool, we.
Speaker B:We.
Speaker B:It like exploded our brains.
Speaker B:We were like.
Speaker B:We couldn't.
Speaker B:We were like, wait a minute.
Speaker B:How is it possible that we're seeing something like that?
Speaker B:And it was a little bit not sad to watch it this time, but it was antiquated where it was like, oh, there's some decent cgi, but now CGI is so normal.
Speaker B:At the time, I was like.
Speaker B:I couldn't believe what I was looking at, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah, no, I agree.
Speaker A:Yeah, there's.
Speaker A:There's wonderful special effects in this, but.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's a little dated, but it's.
Speaker A:It's, you know, it's.
Speaker A:Was great for the time.
Speaker B:Do you prefer.
Speaker B:If you had.
Speaker B:If you had to watch one of them, do you prefer Special Edition or just regular?
Speaker A:You know, I don't think I need to see this movie again.
Speaker B:Yeah, no, no, I hear you.
Speaker A:I loved it.
Speaker A:I loved it in the 90s.
Speaker A:I watched this probably like a dozen times in the 90s and.
Speaker A:But I think I got.
Speaker A:You know what I probably would still watch?
Speaker A:Maybe the theatrical, just because I don't think the 30 minutes really changed my opinion of this movie.
Speaker B:Well, the ending and the special edition is there's something very over the top about it.
Speaker B:Whereas to me, it seems more.
Speaker B:The theatrical edition seems more grounded.
Speaker B:Even though I see no reason why the aliens who for some reason are visiting our planet and hiding underwater, why they reveal themselves to the entire fleet, like, just to save one.
Speaker B:Like, what, What.
Speaker B:What are they doing?
Speaker A:It is also weird that all of a sudden we're so.
Speaker A:We're in this isolated, cold underwater environment.
Speaker A:All of a sudden we have gone global and we're.
Speaker A:We've opened this up to the whole world and it's a very.
Speaker A:It becomes.
Speaker A:I kind of understand why maybe that was cut out for that reason.
Speaker A:It.
Speaker A:It becomes a completely different movie because.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:It's too huge.
Speaker B:All of a sudden.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Deep Impact or Armageddon.
Speaker A:All of a sudden.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Becomes.
Speaker A:And I like the idea that's small story keeping it there.
Speaker A:If there's a way it could have been told without this whole global thing.
Speaker A:But I just don't like the way that it was done underwater where, like, Ed Harris is like.
Speaker A:Is like doing all the exposition for the aliens.
Speaker A:Oh, you don't want us to fight each other.
Speaker A:And that whole thing, I just found it to be so, like, clunky and hokey and.
Speaker A:And the message was just.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker A:It was just.
Speaker B:Just.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker A:It just didn't work for me.
Speaker B:No, I hear you a thousand percent.
Speaker B:That's the thing with this film where.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, keep talking.
Speaker B:I just lost my train of thought.
Speaker B:But it'll come back.
Speaker B:And I totally.
Speaker A:I don't really have anything else.
Speaker A:I'm just kind of frustrated with the end of it because that.
Speaker A:Because.
Speaker B:Oh, God.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:No, that's the thing.
Speaker B:It's like the pieces.
Speaker B:The narrative not quite coalescing and.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, it's gone.
Speaker B:If I'll break in.
Speaker B:If it comes back, you can.
Speaker A:You can get back to it in.
Speaker A:In your final thoughts in your rating.
Speaker A:So let's.
Speaker A:Let's take a break here for a moment and come back with our rate, with our ratings and our final decision on this.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Mark.
Speaker B:Torpedo impact 25 seconds.
Speaker B:The turn.
Speaker B:Captain Notcher, mark.
Speaker B:Plus 8 seconds.
Speaker B:Plus 9.
Speaker B:Plus 10 seconds.
Speaker B:Plus 11.
Speaker B:Plus 12.
Speaker B:Plus 13 seconds.
Speaker B:Plus 14 plus 15 seconds.
Speaker B:Captain, if we're out of position by so much as a boat length.
Speaker B:Torpedo impact now 15 seconds.
Speaker C:Sound collision.
Speaker B:Sound collision.
Speaker B:Captain, we're out of the lake.
Speaker B:You're released.
Speaker B:Borodin rightful rudder.
Speaker B:Reverse starboard engine.
Speaker B:That is brilliant.
Speaker B:Red October, a vastly superior Movie, I must say.
Speaker B:And really quick, I remembered what I was gonna say.
Speaker B:It's a brief comment, but just.
Speaker B:It was making me think about other movies where aliens have visited other Earth.
Speaker B:And I was kept being reminded of Steven Spielberg's Close Encounters, which to me is a much stronger film because, one, there's more of a reason for the aliens visiting.
Speaker B:But two, the.
Speaker B:The way the humans react to it and the way the story progresses, that seems to me like something that may act that could actually happen.
Speaker B:It's still a very sort of positive, optimistic view.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:But that film, just.
Speaker B:Just the way the government deals with the secrecy of it, there's.
Speaker B:I just feel more narrative focus where this movie feels kind of all over the place to me.
Speaker B:James Cameron loving Water.
Speaker B:He wants to do this.
Speaker B:He wants to do sci fi.
Speaker B:And it's a real.
Speaker B:It's a real mixed bag.
Speaker B:Some great editing, spectacular action sequences, but the film just.
Speaker B:Just does not coalesce to me.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Is that your file?
Speaker B:That was it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That was the Close Encounters time.
Speaker B:Because the whole time I was watching this, even the scenes that were supposed to be awe and wonder, when Mary Elizabeth is seeing them for the first time, there's something about it where I was just, like.
Speaker B:I felt what he was trying to go for.
Speaker B:But I've seen that type of story done better in other films.
Speaker B:Films.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I say that as a huge James Cameron fan as well.
Speaker A:All right, so give it a rating.
Speaker B:Boy, how do we do this?
Speaker B:I forgot.
Speaker B:Was it stars?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Up to five.
Speaker A:One to five stars.
Speaker B:Five.
Speaker B:So I would give this movie three stars.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:All right, so my.
Speaker A:My thoughts, you know, some.
Speaker A:Watching the.
Speaker A:The abyss again.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I. I am struck by how much of Cameron's, you know, later work is already bubbling beneath the surface here, quite literally.
Speaker A:And, you know, you can see the seeds of, like, Titanic, you know, in this.
Speaker A:You know, all this.
Speaker A:All those stages of chaos underwater.
Speaker A:There's good balancing of, like, you know, there's human emotion and the.
Speaker A:There's the whole technical spectacle that's in here.
Speaker A:So there's.
Speaker A:There's good.
Speaker A:Good visual storytelling in this movie, I think.
Speaker A:And there is.
Speaker A:There is a. I think a good romance in this movie.
Speaker A:I really do love what's going on with the.
Speaker A:The Brigmans, I'll call them.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:When she almost drowns and dies and she's brought back, that's the one time where I actually felt, like, emotional.
Speaker B:Rarely throughout the rest of the movie, I was like.
Speaker B:But that scene.
Speaker B:I teared up a Little bit.
Speaker A:And I think there's really good, like, art direction here.
Speaker A:I think the rig.
Speaker A:I love the rig.
Speaker A:It feels fully lived in and dirty and grunty and gross.
Speaker A:And I love this underwater world that's here.
Speaker A:Great cinematography, all this technical stuff.
Speaker A:Beautiful.
Speaker A:Well done.
Speaker A:That is where I have the highest respect for this film.
Speaker A:Like I said, Ed Harris, he's really grounded, vulnerable performance as well.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I like the fact that he cast someone who doesn't look like a typical Hollywood leading man.
Speaker A:Also in this, they could have had, you know, Alec Baldwin or somebody that looks like.
Speaker A:Like, you know, a list.
Speaker A:Start playing this in headers.
Speaker A:You know, he's balding.
Speaker A:He's just kind of.
Speaker A:He's probably in his 40s.
Speaker A:In this movie.
Speaker A:They could have had somebody that looks like, you know, an Adonis model playing this.
Speaker A:But I like that Ed Harris fits the look in the role of.
Speaker A:Of somebody who would be a.
Speaker A:An oil worker or somebody.
Speaker A:And I think that he's really great in this.
Speaker A:I love the chemistry with Ed Harris and Mary Elizabeth Master.
Speaker A:Now they know what they reminded me of a lot of, like Han Solo and Leia in, like, Empire Strikes Back kind of.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Sexual tension that they had throughout this.
Speaker A:I. I reminded me a lot of that.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I liked.
Speaker A:I liked that a lot.
Speaker B:They were great.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But I think this movie does fall apart a lot with the writing.
Speaker A:I think the dialogue is painfully clunky at times.
Speaker A:Story just, I think, loses focus, like, halfway through.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And like I said, I don't.
Speaker A:I think there's.
Speaker A:There's just a lot of flaws with that.
Speaker A:And this movie's bold and imaginative and.
Speaker A:But that ending is bizarre and maybe just a little too sentimental.
Speaker B:It's funny.
Speaker B:I saw a clip with Ed Harris there and like, an earlier or a later, like, years later interview.
Speaker B:They're like, what you think of the movie.
Speaker B:He's like, I love the movie, but, man, that ending, like, Ed Harris is not a fan of the ending.
Speaker B:So, like, you're not alone.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But I'd say I also will give this three out of five.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah, it is.
Speaker A:It's half of an excellent movie and half of a movie that has major problems.
Speaker B:It's ambitious.
Speaker B:Like, I applaud the.
Speaker B:What they're.
Speaker B:What he's trying to do.
Speaker B:There's just too many.
Speaker B:Too many plot, too many lines going on here.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And because of that, I.
Speaker A:This is not top tier James Cameron.
Speaker A:And no.
Speaker A:I thought going into this, I was probably thinking that this would be a movie that I would probably give a pass to as something that is worth saving because of the technical achievements of it.
Speaker A:But no, I'm purging this movie.
Speaker B:I'm purging it as well.
Speaker B:I almost.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:Yeah, I feel exactly the same as you.
Speaker B:Like, I just.
Speaker B:I don't really.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:I, I was more appreciative of being reminded of my childhood than watching the actual film.
Speaker B:I know that sounds kind of heartless, but it's sort of how I felt.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:So it is so.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:There it is.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:So that we have passed judgment on the abyss.
Speaker B:It was purged.
Speaker B:Purged.
Speaker A:All right, it is time to get to our recommendations.
Speaker A:Hello.
Speaker A:Welcome to Masterpiece Video.
Speaker A:How may I help you this afternoon, sir?
Speaker B:I'm looking for a copy of Eight and a Half.
Speaker A:Is that a new release, sir?
Speaker B:No, it's the classic Italian film.
Speaker A:Just check that on the computer for you, sir.
Speaker B:Hello.
Speaker A:How are you young ladies this afternoon?
Speaker A:May I help you find a particular Masterpiece movie?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Yes, here it is.
Speaker A:Nine and a Half Weeks with Mickey Rourke.
Speaker A:That would be in the erotic drama section.
Speaker B:No, not Nine and a Half.
Speaker B:Eight and a Half.
Speaker B:The Fellini film.
Speaker B:How about this one?
Speaker A:Get it.
Speaker A:I'm sure it sucks.
Speaker A:All these movies suck.
Speaker A:Our recommendation shelf I.
Speaker A:Late last night, we were texting back and forth.
Speaker A:Sam, I was trying to think of, like, a theme for this.
Speaker A:And you say this is not a bad idea.
Speaker A:I feel like this is one of the worst ones I've ever thought of.
Speaker A:Because we watched the Abyss.
Speaker A:The Abyss.
Speaker A:And it's, you know, obviously every, it's a high pressure environment because they're under deep underwater.
Speaker A:But I feel like we've done like, like a lot of, like, water adventure type, you know, themes.
Speaker A:So I wanted to, Yeah, I wanted to open it up for this one and do something a little different.
Speaker A:And I'm just calling it Pressure Situations.
Speaker A:Which means that we have the option to do either high pressure or low pressure.
Speaker A:Literally, environments.
Speaker A:So we decided that one of us would do high pressure and the other one would do low pressure.
Speaker B:Which I misinterpret because I thought low pressure meant, like, low stakes.
Speaker B:Like, whatever.
Speaker B:Like have a pizza.
Speaker B:It's all good.
Speaker B:Like your cholesterol's fine.
Speaker A:Oh, my God.
Speaker A:So this could be like, like some sort of mumblecore movie you're, you're gonna recommend.
Speaker B:No, I, so I, I, I have a high pressure movie to write recommend.
Speaker B:But like, I'm almost certain I've mentioned it before.
Speaker B:I thought I didn't but my memory is returning and I'm like, no, I think I've mentioned it.
Speaker A:So I was thinking, like, one might be like, underwater movie.
Speaker A:One might be an outer space movie.
Speaker A:But you're going to take the high pressure movie and I'm going to take the low pressure movie.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And mine does involve water.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:So would you like to go first?
Speaker B:I will.
Speaker B:I love this movie.
Speaker B:And, and feel free to make fun of me.
Speaker B:Cause now I'm certain I've mentioned it, but I am picking Ron Howard's thirteen Lives about the Thailand cave.
Speaker A:Oh, okay.
Speaker B:I feel like I must have said it at some point before, but that movie, talk about pressure and tension.
Speaker B:I feel like he just hits that story out of the park.
Speaker B:And I was always kind of upset.
Speaker B:I believe it was Amazon, that it was in the theaters for one weekend and then it just became a streaming movie.
Speaker B:And why no producer or anyone didn't have the confidence to take this Ron Howard film and put it in the theater in the autumn as like a best picture contender.
Speaker B:Event picture.
Speaker B:It was really, really good.
Speaker B:Incredible tension.
Speaker B:The true story of the Thai soccer team that got stuck in the cave waves with the water level rising.
Speaker B:I find the film harrowing and claustrophobic and well made.
Speaker B:So I, I, that's a strong recommend for me.
Speaker A:You know what?
Speaker A:I'm embarrassed.
Speaker A:I have not seen this one.
Speaker B:I think you'd like it.
Speaker B:It's on, I believe.
Speaker B:It's Amazon Prime, I think.
Speaker B:But it's streaming.
Speaker B:Like, it's just, it's there.
Speaker B:It's on the service.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's been on my list for a while.
Speaker A:I just haven't gotten around to it.
Speaker B:Really claustrophobic, but well done.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:All right, great.
Speaker A:I will, I will tease that if, if I.
Speaker A:Last night when we were deciding who was going to do who, I, I had a recommendation for both High Pressure and Low Pressure.
Speaker A:And I did kind of tip my hand.
Speaker A:If I was going to do High Pressure.
Speaker A:I was going to recommend the Hunt for Red October, but I. Oh, I did.
Speaker B:Great movie.
Speaker B:That movie's great.
Speaker A:Because I do love that film and I don't think we've really talked about it much, and I would love to review that movie.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker B:Let's do it sometime.
Speaker B:John McTiern on fire from the late 80s to early 90s.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, that guy.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And there's so many great quotes and that.
Speaker A:And I keep thinking, because this is really funny, because I will actually get to my pick for a moment because, you know, they don't make movies like that anymore.
Speaker A:Because this talk about a movie that is, you know, that about has that tension that I wanted like this to have.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Where there's the threat of nuclear war.
Speaker A:But you'll appreciate this, Sam.
Speaker A:Every, you know, on a blistery windy mornings, I do walk outside and I say to myself, it is cold and hard.
Speaker A:Just like Sean Connory does.
Speaker B:I love brilliant.
Speaker B:That is awesome.
Speaker A:I. I wish I could say in Russian, though.
Speaker B:I do this.
Speaker A:It's cold and hard.
Speaker B:It is cold and hard.
Speaker B:There's.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:There's just one brilliant line in that where James Earl Jones were like, I think Alec Baldwin just like, really speaks his mind and shouts in a meeting.
Speaker B:And like James Earl Jones comes up to me.
Speaker B:He's like, jack, I wanted you to speak your mind, but Jesus, that always cracks me up.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Now we.
Speaker A:We should get to Hunford, October sometime.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Hell yeah.
Speaker B:That'd be great.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:So for real.
Speaker A:For real.
Speaker A:Z.
Speaker A:My pick.
Speaker A:I did Low pressure and, and, oh, that.
Speaker A:That gave me the entire spectrum of outer space movies.
Speaker A:So I was like, whoa, my God.
Speaker A:But I want to do something that made that, you know, I. I don't know.
Speaker A:So here's what I did, all right?
Speaker A:The first time I saw Event Horizon, I remember thinking it was kind of scary and deeply unnerving, but now I can just sit back and love it for pure entertainment.
Speaker A:And so that is my pick.
Speaker A:I. I love, love Event Horizon.
Speaker A:And, you know, this movie has it all.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:Yeah, you know, it really does.
Speaker A:It's got a killer cast.
Speaker A:I got Sam Neill in it, who was in Hunt for October, of course.
Speaker A:Lawrence Fishburne, Kathleen Quinlan.
Speaker A:Jason Isaacs is in this as well, and they're giving it their all.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:And this is Directed by Paul W.S.
Speaker A:anderson, back before he went on to write and direct like, I don't know, like 15 Resident Evil films.
Speaker B:Right, right.
Speaker A:Yeah, whatever.
Speaker A:So this is before that and this is.
Speaker A:This is a really well made movie, I think.
Speaker A:I know it gets a bad rap sometimes, but I think it's coming back around to something that's being appreciated more now.
Speaker B:I enjoy that.
Speaker B: nd honestly, in the summer of: Speaker B:And so no, like, no, my dad, no one else wanted to go with me.
Speaker B:And so I couldn't get to it in the theater, but I really wanted to see it, but my parents weren't interested in it, so I was like, well, damn, I can't I barely had my license then, you know, like.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Well, I see this is the ultimate haunted house in space movie.
Speaker A:So I love this.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Okay, I might be overselling the greatness of this just a little bit, but it's fun, though.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker A:I love this because it nails tension.
Speaker A:It's got an incredible sense of geography.
Speaker A:I think also you always know where you are on the ship and if the ship itself feels like it's a living, breathing character, which is kind of the point of the movie.
Speaker A:But that's what I love about when, when these types of movies are done right.
Speaker A:You, you.
Speaker A:There's many movies that, that it's just, just a garbled mess where it's just like kills and it doesn't really make any sense, but this movie really is pacing itself.
Speaker A:It's good storytelling and it's a really, just a fun, fun ride.
Speaker A:So I really highly recommend this.
Speaker A:And it's wild.
Speaker A:You know, It's.
Speaker A:It's very 90s.
Speaker A:It's really gory.
Speaker A:It's weird.
Speaker A:And so, yeah, good.
Speaker A:Sci fi, horror.
Speaker A:It's not going to change your life, but it'll.
Speaker A:You think twice about booking a deep space, you know, cruise anytime soon.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's genuinely creepy, too, when the ship comes back and it's been gone and you're.
Speaker B:That and you see it just like sitting there and you're like, yeah, that's.
Speaker B:That movie's a lot of fun Now.
Speaker B:Now I actually kind of want to watch it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's streaming right now on Peacock and Hoopa for free.
Speaker A:And you can rent it on vod.
Speaker B:Nice.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Cool.
Speaker B:I know I could have choice.
Speaker A:I could have gone highbrow, you know, but I did not.
Speaker B:No, I, I like that.
Speaker B:No, as this, I like, like, I.
Speaker B:That's a very good choice.
Speaker B:I Now, now I, I'm sold.
Speaker B:Like, I, I've saw it, but it was several years ago, so I'm going to watch it again.
Speaker B:Like, I enjoyed Event Horizon.
Speaker A:All right, excellent.
Speaker A:All right, so next thing.
Speaker A:So, Sam, we are.
Speaker A:We are beginning November, which is a big movie month, but I think that for this next SEG segment, we're just going to talk about a movie that we're both anticipating for this upcoming month.
Speaker A:And you were gonna pick something.
Speaker A:I was gonna pick something.
Speaker A:But we decided that we both are most excited about the same movie coming up, and that is Edgar Wright's the Running man remake now on November 14th.
Speaker A:Now, I think I wouldn't have been nearly as excited if I didn't know that Edgar Wright wasn't behind this as well, which makes it even doubly exciting for me, which, this is really cool.
Speaker A:Hey, let me play the, I have the trailer for this here, so let me throw a few of this up here.
Speaker A:It's pretty cool.
Speaker B:Ben Richards, 35, married.
Speaker B:One child in medical crisis.
Speaker B:We need money for a doctor now, Ben.
Speaker A:Watch us up.
Speaker B:Employment status.
Speaker B:Blacklisted.
Speaker B:But there's still a way out for you.
Speaker B:It's the biggest show in the country.
Speaker B:Blood Luck is our birthright.
Speaker B:Set it free.
Speaker B:Welcome to the Running Man.
Speaker A:Glenn Powell's back.
Speaker A:You finish the shoeing there?
Speaker B:Finish my chips yet?
Speaker B:No, I'm excited about that because one, I think it looks, the trailer looks pretty good anyway.
Speaker B:But also, as an Edgar Wright fan, I have the feeling with, you know, Glenn Powell being this, this movie has more, or at least it appears to have more box office potential than some of his recent films.
Speaker B:And so I'm in his corner.
Speaker B:I, I hope this movie infuses his style with the story and Glenn Powell's performance is great like this.
Speaker B:If this movie is the movie that I think it's going to be, I think it could be very entertaining.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, I'm, I, I'm pretty excited.
Speaker A:Have you, what was the last time you saw the original Running Man?
Speaker B:Oh, it's been so long.
Speaker B:Like, honestly, like childhood long, to the point where I don't even remember it.
Speaker B:Well, to be perfectly honest.
Speaker B:I mean, I would watch it again, but it's been years.
Speaker B:Decades.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:I haven't seen it in.
Speaker A:Oh, it's probably been a good 20 years or so.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a very faded memory.
Speaker A:Yeah, Very, very quotable movie too, though.
Speaker A:I can't wait.
Speaker A:I like to see that again sometimes.
Speaker A:That's the one thing I'm worried about.
Speaker A:Like, you know, make these remakes and, and they're, you know, they're very hit and miss.
Speaker A:But there's something like this, is this going to live in the zeitgeist like the, the original does?
Speaker A:You know, how do you replace Arnold Schwarzenegger and the, the impact that he left in, in this kind of film?
Speaker B:You know, and Arnold Schwarzenegger is so larger than life.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, it's just, it's, it's like classic, so.
Speaker A:And this is Peak Prime Schwarzenegger, so.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker A:You know, I, I don't know.
Speaker A:I mean, it looks good and they got a good team behind it, but.
Speaker B:It'S, I don't know, I'm, I'm optimistic But we'll.
Speaker B:We'll see.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:Well, did you, were you going to mention the, the films that you'd seen recently that.
Speaker B:Yeah, I was actually really interested in that.
Speaker A:I almost forgot about that.
Speaker A:Yes, thank you for bringing that up.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:No, no problem.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:There was a couple things I had.
Speaker A:I was going to mention that, that, you know, it's funny, it's been, it's been a very busy fall for me so far and I have not gotten to the theater as much as I, I normally do or would like to.
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker A:I do want to mention one movie that I have seen that I loved.
Speaker A:I don't know if you've seen it yet.
Speaker B:I've seen it twice.
Speaker B:I saw it in London.
Speaker B:70mm.
Speaker B:Loved it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, that's good.
Speaker A:So I'm talking about one battle after another, the new Paul Thomas Anderson film, which I think is phenomenal.
Speaker B:Loved it.
Speaker A:And the more I think about it and I read some more about it, the more it's, it's.
Speaker A:I, I love it even more because I.
Speaker A:So here a few quick thoughts.
Speaker A:You know, I think this is number one, one of Paul Thomas Anderson's best films.
Speaker B:I would put it in his top three film.
Speaker B:I mean, I was really impressed.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I, I wasn't really over the moon with Phantom Thread.
Speaker A:I remember licorice pizza I thought was decent, but I didn't like love it, love it.
Speaker A:And, but I.
Speaker A:First of all, I think this is a.
Speaker A:Just the fact that we have Leonardo DiCaprio and PTA working together.
Speaker A:This is like a dream, you know, combo of, of talent.
Speaker A:And I think he's terrific in this.
Speaker A:I love the, that, that for an A list star of his stature, he has no qualms about looking disheveled or buffoonish in his movies.
Speaker A:And, and this just makes me appreciate where.
Speaker A:What he does with his career choices even more.
Speaker A:I mean what he did and Killers of the Flower Moon, like he will take on these roles where he is not afraid to be shown in an unflattering light.
Speaker A:And I have the highest respect for what he's doing these days.
Speaker A:And he is grown into the type of actor that almost like what Cary Grant became in his 50s and, and later.
Speaker A:So I, I'm.
Speaker A:I just love what he is doing now more than just a pretty face.
Speaker B:Like, oh my God.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's real great.
Speaker A:So the cat, the cast in this is just turning into.
Speaker A:In unbelievable performance.
Speaker A:Benicio Del Toro is the karate sense and brings this, this gravitas and calmness to all the chaos that's going on around him.
Speaker B:I saw a great Q and A, literally, like Steven Spielberg was interviewing P.T.
Speaker B:anderson.
Speaker B:They were just talking about one battle after another.
Speaker B:And Spielberg said that it is his favorite Sean Penn performance.
Speaker B:He said in this movie, it's his favorite Sean Penn performance.
Speaker B:I thought Sean Penn was great.
Speaker B:A incredible.
Speaker A:Sean Penn is all but guaranteed a best supporting actor.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And he mean, he.
Speaker A:Now when Sean Pen was great, this.
Speaker A:He developed a whole like walk for this movie.
Speaker A:You know, like he's got like a.
Speaker A:A rod up his ass the whole movie.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But I think beyond just the performances and the great writing, what I think is, by the way, the pacing and momentum.
Speaker A:Oh my God, is so good.
Speaker A:It just moves.
Speaker A:And I think it's aided by.
Speaker A:By this propulsive like rat attack energy that is driven by the.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:There's a Johnny Greenwood score that is just so good in this movie.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But what I was.
Speaker A:But I think what is refreshing that what a lot of movies lack that about.
Speaker A:I'm tongue tied here, but is that this movie is about something and it's Is, you know, you got this father, daughter relationships, the systemic power, the.
Speaker A:The polarized world that we live in and the extreme actually on both sides, you know, is what we're talking about here.
Speaker A:And it really is bringing on a lot of, I think, conversations that I've read online.
Speaker A:And it's just movies I think everybody needs to see.
Speaker A:And it's incredible.
Speaker B:And you talk about the pacing.
Speaker B:This movie was 2 hours and 45 minutes and it went by in a flash for me.
Speaker B:When it got to the end, I was like, oh, it was so good.
Speaker B:I would have loved a little bit more.
Speaker B:Like, I was so entertained.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:The movie felt.
Speaker B:It didn't feel like short, short, but I was that it just like zipped by.
Speaker B:It was just incredible.
Speaker A:It is the fastest 2 hour and 45 minute movie I've.
Speaker A:Oh my God.
Speaker B:God, me too.
Speaker A:Yeah, it does.
Speaker A:And funny too.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker B:Oh, hysterical.
Speaker B:Like the.
Speaker B:The Christmas Adventurers Club, those guys.
Speaker B:I was like, oh my God.
Speaker B:This is.
Speaker A:Is that what it was or.
Speaker B:Amazing.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And the.
Speaker A:Yeah, so it was really love that.
Speaker A:I'm gonna see it again.
Speaker A:I want to see it again the theater before it goes out.
Speaker A:I think in the last week or two, I'm gonna try to.
Speaker B:It's funny because I though I. I saw it in 70 millimeter, but the problem was I was at this theater called the Odeon in.
Speaker B:In Leicester Square in London.
Speaker B:But what it is, it's it's an old, it's a premier theater, but it's like an old kind of, kind of stage style theater.
Speaker B:And so the seat I had, the screen was extremely small and far away.
Speaker B:So I felt like I was watching it in an echo chamber.
Speaker B:So I made a point to go see it again a week later in a modern theater with like, you know, and a cup.
Speaker B:And I'm so glad I did because nothing against that theater, it's classic, it's.
Speaker B:It's historic.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:I saw the Two Towers there.
Speaker B:It was like one of the best movie theater experiences I had in my life.
Speaker B:But long story short, one battle after another is even better.
Speaker B:A second time.
Speaker B:It's just, it doesn't diminish at all.
Speaker B:It just, it gets better and better.
Speaker B:Like, I think it's one of his best.
Speaker B:I think it's a strong best picture, best director contender.
Speaker B:We'll see.
Speaker A:No, no doubt.
Speaker A:It's good.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's going to be right up there.
Speaker A:Good.
Speaker A:Anything you want to mention, I will.
Speaker B:Say very briefly, I'm a huge fan of the Conjuring films and I did see the Conjuring Last Rights, which I was really happy for its enormous box office.
Speaker B:For me, the appeal of that movie is Patrick Wilson and Vera Formiga and they were great.
Speaker B:I thought the movie itself was okay.
Speaker B:So, so.
Speaker B:But spoiler free.
Speaker B:It was fun watching them.
Speaker B:And this movie is the last film in the Conjuring universe, specifically about the two of them.
Speaker B:So they are, are like dispatched to their destinies in this film.
Speaker B:Not death or anything like that.
Speaker B:I'm just saying, like it.
Speaker B:The story makes it clear that this is the last movie that's going to focus on them.
Speaker B:And I felt very nostalgic.
Speaker B:I'm surprised.
Speaker B: the time that's passed since: Speaker B:The conjuring, which I love.
Speaker B:So I enjoyed it.
Speaker B:But in terms of the thrills and the scary story itself, it was just solid and okay.
Speaker B:But it was worth it seeing it for the two of them.
Speaker B:Them.
Speaker B:The movie itself, fine.
Speaker B:I don't know if I would hugely recommend it, but I, I like that I.
Speaker B:They are such good actors and their chemistry.
Speaker B:Like they're, they're the, the characters that made the movie for me.
Speaker B:So I'd give it, you know, like maybe like barely three stars, two and a half, but.
Speaker B:But like, wow.
Speaker B:I like seeing them.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Ring an endorsement.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Well, like you, it's.
Speaker B:I haven't seen a lot of movies recently.
Speaker B:It was the only other one.
Speaker B:But, like, I like, like them a lot.
Speaker B:So see it.
Speaker B:Give it a chance.
Speaker B:But you don't have to go to the theater to see it, you know, watch it on streaming.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:I think that brings us to the close of our show, but just wanted to mention that to stay tuned for a next episode we're going to do, and that's going to be maybe in a few weeks or a month, we're going to drop an episode.
Speaker A:The next episode on our James Cameron retrospective.
Speaker A:We're gonna do True Lies, which I haven't seen since it came out.
Speaker A:I've seen it one time in my life.
Speaker A:Oh, wow.
Speaker B:This will be a good conversation.
Speaker B:Look, the bridge is out.
Speaker B:The bridge is out.
Speaker A:Little sneak peek there.
Speaker A:Can't wait to see that.
Speaker B:That's gonna be great.
Speaker B:That'll be a lot of fun.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:So that is our show for this week.
Speaker A:Back to the Frame Rate is part of the Weston Media Podcast Network.
Speaker A:Special thanks to Brian Ellsworth for our show opening.
Speaker A:On behalf of all of us, we bid you farewell from the fall shelter.
Speaker A:If you enjoy the show, please subscribe and leave a rating review on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or your favorite podcast platform.
Speaker A:You will always find our episodes@backtotheframerate.com this is the end of our transmission.
Speaker A:Back to the Frame Rate.
Speaker A:Signing off.
Speaker B:Want you to know it's over.
Speaker B:Well.
Speaker A:Bye.
